Brexit 5

Squirmy in the intellectual sense of squashing your opponent's (in the
is case the Lib-Dem take on a second EU referendum) ridiculous argument.

Disclaimer: Squashing bad arguments is not nasty. We should do more of it, e.g. when presented with tosh like de-platforming someone just because you disagree with them, or providing "safe spaces" for Snowflake Generation university students so they don't have to read or hear anything that might upset them, poor dears.

And irrelevant.

It is a good, squirmy four minutes, isn't it, petra?

She's not snobbish. That's just stupid thinking.

thatbags Thanks for the link to the Julia Bradbury interview, brilliant!!
I had no idea that Julia was so ballsy. The heavy sarcasm went right over that Sarah Js head, wonderful.
Julia was never like that on country file

Thanks for the link to the 'God will help me' article and comments DJ. As a non-believer it concerns me greatly when someone purports to have God on their side and implies that we should all be comforted by that. I wonder if God knows she thinks he has her back.

I had wondered how she squares what her Government is doing especially to the weak, sick and vulnerable with her religious beliefs.

'Love thy neighbour', ... especially the poor and disabled; 'Suffer little children to come to me',...especially the little ones from Aleppo.

'faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity' ... especially to the homeless.

My belief is that we are here to care for one another, that the strong should support the weak; that we should love our neighhour as ourselves and that we should make sure that no one goes hungry or is forced to sleep on cold pavements or in dirty doorways.

There is more than one form goodness and you don't have to have faith to be a caring human being.

I wouldn't know, dj. I'd never heard of Julia H-B before today. Also, her snobbishness or otherwise doesn't make any difference to the point she was making rather well against SarahJ's argument. Silly, therefore, to mention it.

So they voted Libdem instead? That's just stupid thinking. Zac Goldsmith voted to leave. The leavers should have voted for him if they still wanted us to leave the EU.
Obviously a third of those who voted leave did not want to any more.
I read an email saying that there will not be a sudden election, because Maidenhead is very similar to Richmond as far as politics is concerned.

Well, they didn't have a Conservative candidate to vote for, did they?

"If I tell you that nearly a third of Tory voters from the last election who voted leave in June voted Liberal Democrat yesterday, you will see that this is not just about a remain versus leave rerun, it’s about people trying to say to Theresa May: we do not like the extreme version of Brexit outside the single market you are taking us down.”

Such a snobby interviewer.

Julia Hartley-Brewer talks to the new Richmond Lib-Dem MP, Sarah Jolney about what a majority vote means. 4 mins.

Very kind of Theresa May to let the three Brexiteers give different ideas on Brexit. I wonder which one of them is the closest to hers. Does she actually just sit there saying Brexit is Brexit at all these meetings they have, or do they just toss coins to see who is going to make the next idiotic comment?

So who reckons we will be contributing financially to the EU -David Davis does.

Dear oh dear. The hypocrisy leaves me breathless.

This is the only person who knows the future for Brexit, guided by God.

politicalscrapbook.net/2016/11/god-me-will-help-me-guide-brexit-theresa-may-says-in-interview/

The comments are worth reading, too.

I wasn't asking for a dictionary definition of sovereignty. I was asking for your definition in the context of the EU.

Nobody (I hope) expects experts to be infallible, but I cannot accept the contempt shown to anybody with any knowledge by some people. At least experts have the background to argue and discuss with insight.

If you suspect that an expert is wrong, the sensible thing to do is to inform yourself and argue from a position of knowledge. Have you, by any chance, found an 'alternative' Full Fact?

@Azie Support for the return of capital punishment has never gone away. Polls show almost half the population supports it and sometimes even more. Yes, it's frightening.

My big fat dictionary defines 'sovereignty as 'supreme and independent power'.

I know a little bit about the fallibility of experts, having once been a minor expert myself. In my experience, experts can sometimes tell you about the past and present but, quite often, little about the future. Few experts saw 'The Credit Crunch' coming and, as often as not, one expert will say one thing and another expert will say the opposite. The expert I take most seriously is the electrician who says that, if I put my finger in the socket and turn on the light, I will get a shock.

I do not ignore expert opinion but I have learnt not to accept everything an expert says as gospel. Back in the day, in 1873, Dr Edward Clarke, a Harvard Professor, wrote that it was unwise, even dangerous, to over-educate women because it would make them ill and, potentially, unable to bear children. He was an expert of his day.

ukandeu.ac.uk/explainers/a-three-minute-guide-to-democracy-and-sovereignty/

Cunco, do you know about this site?

ukandeu.ac.uk/analysis/

A lot of facts, from experts. Do you like experts, because some leavers don't.

I had not heard about the proposed return of capital punishment by referendum. That says it all about the downward path I feel we are heading. I have no doubt that the masses, led by The Sun and The Daily Express, would love to see the return of capital punishment, not limited to child murderers.
So how do you define a child? How many retrials and unsafe convictions have there been in the last 50 years? Not enough to convince some that capital punishment is a dodgy, revengeful act. What about those women convicted of killing their children where it subsequently turned out to have been cot death? What about the recent questioning of shaken baby syndrome? I have been on jury service twice and I have seen the unreliability of ordinary citizens to decide beyond their prejudices. Likewise the honesty of the police force, sadly.
I am going away to lie down, beyond believe.

The new UKIP leader knows the voters , when he spoke on the death penalty it was in support of child murderers not all murderers

So what do you think 'sovereignty' means, cunco?

Of course I don't think you're all heathens and not capable of thinking for yourselves, but look up the results of some of the most recent elections and by-elections and referendum result in some of the old industrial small/medium towns and even the suburbs of Manchester and Liverpool, etc. Listen to what the MPs from these places are saying. People aren't being swayed by facts, but by values and beliefs, some of which are based on myths and prejudice.

Leaders who glory in committing hate crime?
Nigel Farage.
Paul Nuttall.

Do you not think people in the North are capable of realising they have been conned, daphne?
What a low opinion you have of us.

The new UKIP leader wants his next referendum to be on capital punishment. We're not all heathens up here.