More United - is this the way forward in politics?

I think it will be an interesting one to watch over the summer. I don't know where it will lead or what the outcome will be or what influence it will have on the parties but I shall watch and learn.

Spot on POGS, Corbyn is planning to deselect many labour MP's , they will not leave the party so he will get them out by deselection. Ashdown is hoping for a gang of 170 not a gang of 4 to join with his party

For what it's worth I think Ashdown knows the Lib Dems are not getting anywhere as a party and is looking to start a new party of LibDems alongside the disheartened Labour voters because of Corbyn's Leadership.

This is just another question as to whether Labour will 'split'. I think there is every chance of that happening if the threats of 'deselection' occur as Corbyn will win the Leadership again.

This is a mirror/repeat of the Gang of Four Limehouse Declaration with Ashdown as it's PR Head. The fact there will be so many left wing parties prepared to 'unite' in cooperation with each other eg Greens, SNP, Ashdowns Party , Plaid Cymru etc. will possibly be a show of strength. The question is for how long? When the voter wonders which party to back if they all become so united and not a fag paper of difference between them what would be the point of having so many left wing parties vying for attention and votes?

Daphne's, this us what the leader should be doing but he isn't, he is letting McDonald and McClusky do the talking whilst he basks in the admiration of young women and momentum rallies

www.change.org/p/restore-truthful-politics-create-an-independent-office-to-monitor-political-campaigns/u/17377637

www.change.org/p/restore-truthful-politics-create-an-independent-office-to-monitor-political-campaigns

165,000 supporters on this petition, started by one of the convenors.

@ab

Until there's a new government, they could start by having some plans. As somebody else wrote, all they have is 'airy fairy' rhetoric.

Blimey I'm married to a momentum groupie but I bet he'd be amused to be described as such. To me he looks like a 64 year old bloke with a dickie heart and a metal knee, but a good head of hair. I haven't heard him singing the Red Flag but you never know, and I don't think he's got a tee shirt yet....

Gracesgran, if you had to vote for a far left party who said they would build 100,000 social housing knowing they would never be elected because the country will not support far left parties , or a centre party who promised to build 50,000 social housing and they stood a chance on winning which would you vote for? Even though I sm on the left I would vote for the centre party, I have a roof over my head , so many haven't and this is what matters to me, the vunerable

Devorgilla Sun 24-Jul-16 21:03:45

... When asked about getting into Government, they seem totally unconcerned by this as being true to the purity of the ideology is what matters. ...

This just seems yet another bit of the world that is out of balance. We swung so far towards "anything in order to get elected" that I am not surprised to find a rebalancing going on which swings to the other extreme.

Daphne, nothing can be done untill we get a new government, think of the harm done by the Tory government and with a small majority, bedroom tax, benefits cuts, no benefits for unemployed young people, no social housing, refusal to bring in a rent cap, large increase in food banks , homeless double in a year. And I think May is more to the right than Cameron.

We need a strong oposition party who can go on to win an election.

Nothing can be done right now, parliment is in recess untill September, some labour MP's are unable to hold their surgeries.

I will remain a Labour member Untill certain MP's should choose to leave or are deselected

Well I joined as soon as it appeared

@ab

Good! I hope he knows what he's doing.

Well said, Devorgilla! I saw somebody being accused of being a Fabian the other day (and, therefore, not a true socialist). I thought "wtf does it matter what name he calls himself". I'm sure discussing the nature of socialism and which sort is 'pure' is a fascinating topic, but I just want something done.

whitewall, this is true and heavens knows what will fill it. I have, as yet, not encountered a Momentum 'groupie' but I know people who have. When asked about getting into Government, they seem totally unconcerned by this as being true to the purity of the ideology is what matters. This was said in an actual discussion. Not to my disabled grandchild it doesn't. People in power fighting every inch of the way for decent benefits is what is needed, not airy fairy nonsense at rallies no matter how grandiose and effective it sounds.

Nature doesn't like a vacuum annie

Paddy has ambitions to speed up the rebirth of his party

@Gg

My problem with Labour with Corbyn is that it doesn't appear to have any REAL policies, apart from anti-war and a bit about equality. Most of it is rhetoric - and pretty empty rhetoric. A stance on war (and weapons, etc) and equality are important, but it's not possible to frame a whole government round those issues. It seems like student and pressure group politics.

It also seems to me that Labour is more concerned about sorting out factions within the party than doing the job it has been elected to do.

My guess is that most people are more concerned about the roof over their heads, food on the table, having a reasonably secure job without recourse to benefits, having their children in a reasonable school and healthcare when they need it. They would probably opt for a mixed economy with a social safety net when needed.

Over the last six years, the Conservatives have eroded that safety net and shown a lack of concern for people's jobs and well-being, while filling their own pockets. There is a real sense of unfairness and there is a growing desperation that will continue. Hence the referendum result, Ukip and Momentum.

However, if you analyse the referendum result, it won't result in greater fairness and Momentum doesn't seem to have many realistic, concrete ideas either. Without an economic framework, it can't deliver anything. Ukip is the mirror image of Momentum.

I have only voted Labour once. All the shenanigans in the Labour Party mean that I will almost certainly never vote for them again. So my vote is up for grabs!

Gracesgran - possibly. I am cynical enough to believe there may be an element of opportunism in it all. It worked for UKIP.
A total mess at the moment.
Nice to encounter a true floating voter though.

He's always supported collaboration rather than a new left of centre party. There are many voters who would probably place themselves in that position on the political spectrum, who are currently disenfranchised by the FPTP system.
Interesting you read the runes this way dd. It must make sense to anyone in favour of PR I would think as that will always be about collaboration. I really do like the fact that the no party in Scotland could have an overall majority if they hadn't got more than 50% of the overall vote. He seem to make a reference to this (majority not Scotland) in his Marr interview and I would certainly agree with that.

Obieone hope seems like a good thing to me .

Devorgilla I wonder if your views on parties - I agree by the way and it has put me off joining parties - is why they have gone for this movement.

GNHQ Thank you so much for changing the title; that makes it much clearer.

I agree with you about the only perfect party being one with only yourself as member . Meanwhile, people end up making compromises. With the current system that means a choice between the two biggest parties (or possibly Ukip). A genuine centrist (or left of centrist) would find it impossible to vote for Ukip or the Conservatives, but Labour with Corbyn as leader isn't an alternative either.

I don't 'buy' the idea that the Conservatives and Blairite Labour were both the same with a centrist agenda. I think there's a gaping hole in British politics for a progressive left of centre party.

Not sure this would be for me at the moment. I await the final outcome of the Labour vote and fall out. Too many cooks and all that. For me there is never a perfect party unless you formed it and are the only member. Even then I'd disagree with myself. The best you can hope for is the one closest to your own principles whose policies tick the most boxes.

Ashdown has been talking about something like this for a while.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jun/19/lord-ashdown-progressive-parties-in-britain-should-work-together

He's always supported collaboration rather than a new left of centre party. There are many voters who would probably place themselves in that position on the political spectrum, who are currently disenfranchised by the FPTP system.

Caroline Lucas has said that she'd be interested in collaboration, so maybe the movement would fund Green candidates, LibDems, independents and 'others' from the Labour and Conservative parties, if they end up going to the right and left.

My town currently has an independent town council, independents are the second group on the district council and we have an independent county councillor. A dynamic independent candidate for Westminster would stand an outside chance.

PS. I still don't see how it would really work in practice.

PPS. Arron Banks (Ukip's bankroller) has also been suggesting a new party with a similar structure, so maybe it is the way forward. Using the internet would mean that MPs would be in more direct contact with constituents than layers of party bureaucracy.

To me, this is just another "hope" thing.

Like "hope" for a second referendum petition
"hope" from Nicola Sturgeon for her veto
"hope" from Nicola Sturgeon that Scotland can be remain, even though it is part of Britain which has voted to Leave.

Perhaps if there is enough support it will "encourage" the main parties to rethink their strategy to appeal to the voter. I am not really convinced this is a runner though.