A new Centre party?

What about this for an idea?

theconversation.com/letter-to-david-cameron-split-your-party-and-start-a-new-one-to-save-britain-61893

voxpoliticalonline.com/2016/07/02/mcdonnell-has-claimed-osbornes-decision-to-drop-surplus-target-as-a-labour-victory/

John McDonnell is taking the credit for Osborne's change of heart, but, as usual, nobody listens to him or Corbyn.

Hmmm! That actually sounds quite a good idea. Whether Cameron is man enough to do it, I don't know.

I often think about one of the most influential governments of the last 100 years - Churchill's wartime coalition. While the country was busy fighting a war, the basis of the modern welfare state was being written. Attlee was Labour; Beveridge was Liberal and Rab Butler (who introduced FREE grammar schools and raised the school leaving age) was Conservative.

How could labour and Tories form a coalition party? Corbyn even refused to take part in any tv debates involving members of others parties

The link does not talk about Corbyn joining the DCP, but the right wing labour members helping to set it up, like Benn and Hunt.

So Benn should leave the party?

Well whatever finally happens I do think that both the main political parties and to a lesser e xtent the Libs are really coalitions anyway.

It may be that both parties need to re-examine their basic philosophy to see if first it fits with its members and second if it fits with the voting population. I think the answer to a large extent in both cases is no. Perhaps the current turmoil will result in new political parties that fit better with people's needs, although I won't hold my breath as I see no passion or commitment from anyone. I only see career politicians with commitment only to the extent it furthers their career.

I don't think Cameron is man enough to do it dd. His political judgement has been shown to be wanting over and over again. I, for one, would never vote for a party led by a man whose lack of judgement and foresight has plunged this country into political and economic chaos.

I find 'centrist' Labour very hard to stomach, too. I didn't notice any vigorous defence of Labour's handling of the 2008 financial crisis in the last election, or hear any coherent 'non-austerity' policy being proposed.

I feel very sorry for the Lib-Dems as they were clearly the scapegoats for the failings of the Coalition government but I think it will take years to rehabilitate them.

I very much like Wilma's and dd's manifestos! The problem is finding a party that fits them.

The lib Dems lost support when Clegg went back on the university fees promise which they had campaigned on and won support of students

That's what the article said, Anniebach. I disagreed with it.

The strange thing is, I could see Cameron sounding it out now behind the barricades.
He was always someone to hedge his bets.
Too many cliches there, but you know what I mean.
His only other job was PR, after all, usually PR for himself.

I've spoken to my LibDem councilor/parliamentary candidate about the tuition fees fiasco, ab. What he said was that Nick Clegg traded tuition fees for the pupil premium, which I expect you know is worth nearly £1000 a year for every child from a poorer home.

Clegg's argument was that support for university generally went to teenagers from wealthier homes, but pupil premium would go to children from poorer homes.

I don't think it actually works out like that in practice, but I think Clegg had a point. His huge mistake was not to let everybody know his reasoning.

Without the LibDems, the Conservatives have done much more damage to student finance by abolishing means tested bursaries completely, but that seems to have gone under the radar. The Conservatives are now considering abolishing pupil premiums.

Right, let's look at this new centre party for labour. Corbyn v Benn . Thry both cannot be The Labour Party. Cannot be New Labour so call them X. Where does the London mayor belong, he didn't want Corbyn campaigning with him. Will he join X. Where do the new labour MP's go, they joined lithe Labour Party now have to choose to leave and join X whilst some remain labour.What about the Welsh Labour Party? Thry split and labour has lost power in the Senydd , There could be more UKIP than Labour or X

On,y one seat in Scotland but the leader and deputy leader now disagree , where do labour members go, with labour or X

Hmmppphhh! I take your point, ab, but what's to be done? If there is no effective opposition to the Conservatives, they'll just carry on destroying welfare, turning a blind eye to tax evasion, destroying education, and the NHS, privatising/selling everything etc etc. The majority of people have never voted for them, but the majority have no voice.

The only answer is a strong opposition daphne , we did it before by moving to the centre , this wasn't perfect , but it worked . I do know Gordon Brown had to agonise over moving towards the centre but he did it because he put the party first , he accepted this was the only way for labour to gain power, and they did . As did Robin Cook and many others who were to the left but not far left . I asked on another thread if anyone remembers the wilderness years , no replies . Either no or amnesia because anyone who stuck with labour at that time would remember how hard it was to keep fighting

Isn't Blairism still a toxic word?

(I agree with you, by the way.)

I am not thinking of Blairism daphne, yes he is toxic now but seems the good done in those years is forgotten . Blair has gone .

I wish he were gone - he seems to pop up whenever he's least wanted!

I agree with you. Labour needs to come up with solid policies, which might sacrifice 'pure' socialism. Its priority must be to get elected without lying and making unrealistic promises. Is there anybody within the PLP capable of realising that kind of vision?

Daphne, the problem is anyone who entered parliament before 2007 will be classed a Blairite, this leaves MP's who have been an MP for only less than 10 years. Even those who are not far left are classed a Blairite even though they were not MP's when he was PM

Just read that Blair wants to lead the negotiations with the EU !

Oh nooooo! Told you he pops up when least wanted!

"Who will rid me of this troublesome priest?"

Where are the MI5 spooks when you need them?

Owen Smith isn't a Blairite.

I remember the wilderness years. We lived in Peterborough for most of that time and had a Labour MP. We were members of the Labour party there. Do not know anyone who lives there now who was a member of the Labour party back then. They've all moved away.

Forgot to add, it's now strong Tory, because of immigration, which is weird, because Peterborough was built on immigration.

Owen Smith became an MP for Pontypridd in 2010