What a difficult decision to make.

Eighteen posters so far on this thread. Out of how many members now? I wonder if people are too nervous to put their heads above the parapet on contentious threads.

No need to feel inferior, pompa. I daresay I didn't know the difference until I read more about it. My comment was not said in a tone of pedantry; it was simply to point out what is, in fact, a fundamental difference between the two things and, since it's death and dying we're talking about, to clarify an important distinction on a sensitive subject.

Some people (not you, obviously) use the term euthanasia deliberately when they mean assisted dying. That, I feel, is an unfair tactic. I wished to forestall that happening here.

No-one need take my comment about the distinction of meanings personally. It was not a personal comment but a general one.

Good point pompa and well put

Agree with others, what Shipman did frightened other doctors from ever helping anyone with morphine (increased dosage.)Him and some nurses who turned whistleblower about morphine dosage in hospitals.

Pompa, you are a man, ergo you can never be right!Only joking of course.

granjura is right to refer to the impact of Shipman's murderous behaviour on doctors ability or willingness to do what countless others did before them. It was common for increasing doses of drugs, usually morphine, to be given to the dying to ease their way.

Apologies to gj for not including her in my support for granny twice and Ana when I commented on this thread yesterday evening. X post granjura. The experience you have because of where you live is particularly valuable to this discussion.

Not every one has the mastery of vocabulary that brings exactly the right word to mind, I am one of those. Being pedantic just make those like me feel inferior.

Pompa, it is absolutely essential people use the right word- for the right concept, in this instance. I find it almost impossible to believe that some people can confuse or even compare, euthanasia and assisted dying- let alone capital punishment.

Sadly, since Shipman, doctors are very hesitant to help someone for the fear of being accused and sued. In the pre Shipman days, it was fairly common, even with the Royals- for an imminent death to be deliberately hastened with increased dosage of drugs, usually morphine, as a gesture of human kindness and compassion. We don't allow animals to suffer- why should we do so with those humans we truly love?

Well said Anya and Roses totally agree.

When I set this thread going I was expecting a torrent of anti assisted dying. I am relieved to see from my calculation that there are more in favour than against.

When my dear mum had had enough she refused food and eventually water. I was criticised for going along with her plan. I did what she wanted and have no regrets. I miss her every day.

I believe that a very high percentage of the population is in favour of making assisted dying legal in thr UK.

pompa, I expect most on this thread are talking about assisted dying but at least one poster mentioned euthanasia as if that's what we are talking about. That is why I commented on the difference. Words matter because the wrong word means people misunderstand.

As you were.

Agreed, they certainly should.as another poster has said, why do we treat human beings in a worse way thatn animals, when we end their lives for them and don't allow them to suffer terribly until they die?Both end of life care and a centre like Dignitas is needed.

Of course people should be able to choose how they die when they are terminally ill.

People are left to die in terrible pain. I had to throw a hissy fit in a hospital ward in 2002 before the nursing staff would summon a doctor to prescribe pain relief for my dying FiL.

I'm not ashamed of what I did and I'd do it again

Grannytwice the two cases you linked to are indeed horrible. We do not have a perfect healthcare system. Some hospitals are badly run. It is good these cases have been identified and investigated. Hopefully things will improve as more hospitals are 'Ofsteded'.

I hope things are left as they are, with improvements in end of life care. I would not want to see a Dignitas in this country.

which in this instance means grandkids around.

And let us not forget the Greek roots of the word euthanasia, either. It is made up of two parts which mean, respectively, good or well, and death - a good death, as opposed to a bad death. It now means putting someone (or some animal) to death which is more specific, and nothing to do with deciding that life has come full circle and it is time to get off the roundabout.

All the good end-of-life care in the world makes no difference if someone really wishes to be out of it - as my dear husband said a few days before he died "This is getting tedious" He would have been pleased to choose the time of his departure, not wait for it like a long-delayed train.

Thatbags, you are quite right, but I suspect "assisted dying" is what most of us are talking about, the exact word does not change the comments. I doubt anyone would condone true euthanasia. Let's not get too pedantic about such a serious subject that affects some of us deeply.

Assisted dying is not euthanasia. It is mistaken to conflate the two. Dignity in Dying and other similar organisations in other countries explain the differences very well.

thatbags brought up the church. I didnt.

I thought that people would want it looked up, but no I wont.

Ana. Agree to differ.

oh soon what rubbish you spout sometimes, dont bother looking it up in the Bible I dont want to know. My DF chose to end his own life by turning his head to the wall, refusing food and drink, he chose to end his life in his own home in his own bed while he had the voice to do so and we, his family, supported him in his decision.

Of course there were people before the church.

thatbags and fleetstreetfox[whoever he is].

First one. Humans dont "allow" someone to kill themselves in messy..
Do they? Or am I completely misunderstanding his tweet.

2nd one. What a load of rubbish[to fleetstreetfox]

3rd one. I have been thinking about that this morning. I am not sure that the Bible says this, though I could be wrong. I need to look it up.
The church may have said so, so he could be right on that part.
[there were not people before the church].

There are other kinds of pain to the physical ones, too. Given a terminal illness which they know will end in complete bodily, mental and emotional breakdown, many people would rather die when they choose to, rather than fight the inevitable decline. They stop eating and drinking and "turn their faces to the wall". Much better for them and for their loved ones to take a conscious and informed decision and make their exit with dignity. To misquote T S Eliot " not with a whimper but a bang"