Fat (topic du jour)

Re exdancer post about starvation in the concentration camps:
A study of Dutch women who suffered greatly with starvation during Ww11 showed their bodies reaction to starvation was passed onto their daughters and then grand daughters.
They had more fat cells and put on more weight quicker, and stayed that way for the majority of their lives.
Resetting the dna of the offspring to guard against ultimate death.
It seems as if the need to hold onto calories to stay alive is so strong as a survival mechanism, that it is passed on to at least 2 generations.

If that is indeed the case, I wonder what self induced starvation (feeling hungry and denying the body calories, ie strict dieting) is actually achieving?

I'm pretty much the same weight that I was in my 20's but in my 50's, having had a hysterectomy with removal of my ovaries, I put on 2 stone. Coming up to 60, I took the decision to work with a personal trainer which really upped my exercise and I lost the 2 stone. I have kept it off for the last 13 years by keeping track of my weight and taking action as soon as I was 7 lbs over my ideal weight. Losing half a stone is relatively easy and requires little effort, although as I've got older it has got slightly harder. I don't diet, I fast by either strictly limiting calories on two days a week or by cutting down to two meals per day with a long break between, eg I fast for 16 hours. I don't go to the gym or do high impact classes anymore but I do dog walk, ride and do 2 weekly pilates classes. I have a happy relationship with food, enjoy a glass or two of wine and often have a chocolate or two. I don't eat much processed food but nothing is taboo. It works for me.

Totally disagree with this as very heavy weight leads to diabetes, heart problems, joint problems, and premature death.
There are very few obese people who live into their 90s. OH is obese and borderline diabetic with knee and hip arthritis.

My mother was five foot two and thirteen stone for most of her life. She ate all kinds of food including butter and fatty meat and drank Guiness daily. She had no health problems whatsoever until she developed osteoarthritis in her knees when in her eighties. She lived until she was ninety four.
There is too much obsession with weight and diet nowadays.

Which goes to show that for every anecdotal item of “evidence”, somebody can come up with the opposite!
My grandfather used to say the best dietitian of all time was Marie Lloyd when she sang “A little of what you fancy does you good!”

I have believed for a long time that what and how much you eat has a far bigger impact on weight than exercise. Thermal dynamics really. Exercise does help to maintain body strength but it doesn't need to be excessive for that.

MawtheMerrier

Which goes to show that for every anecdotal item of “evidence”, somebody can come up with the opposite!
My grandfather used to say the best dietitian of all time was Marie Lloyd when she sang “A little of what you fancy does you good!”

So that's where my mother got that saying from!

Interesting.
I believe that everybody has an ideal weight that their bodies will naturally try to stick to.

I don't think our joints are designed to carry heavy weightless. That's why obese people struggle with their knees and often end up needing knee replacements.
We just aren't designed to be so big.

heavy weightloads not weightless.

GPs suggest switching to a Mediterranean diet these days don't they?

GagaJo thank you for raising these issues. Thin people I know have developed T1 or T2 diabetes. Another aspect is that being plump can bring on the blame in primary care that ‘ It’s because you’re overweight’.

Both my grandmothers were plump and very active. One lived to 94, the other to 89.

I have been thinking about weight loss and exercise.

I walk the dog for approx, 2 hours a day. It makes no difference to my weight.

My son throughout the winter when he has little exercise puts on about a stone.

Throughout the “dry” season - no mud, he mountain bikes over the South and North Downs, cycling anything up to 60 miles+ in a day. He loses all the weight he had put on the previous winter. His diet doesn’t change.

So I think that to lose weight by exercise only, you really have to go some?

Urmstongran

I’m eating super healthily on my low carb diet as recommended by an NHS senior dietician in a diabetes prevention class. Four weeks in and I’ve lost half a stone. I’m more than phase, especially as I’m never hungry! She suggested only eating whole foods ‘that your grandmother would recognise!’. No packets of crisps, I don’t bake so no bought cakes or packets of biscuits (preservatives in them), no chocolate, I’ve also kick started all this with no alcohol this past fortnight. My motivation is high. I don’t want to develop diabetes and be on metformin or gliclizide, doing thumb pricks etc. I’ve 3x as much to lose so it’s early days I realise. But I’m fed up too of being fat.

An interesting article though gagaJo!
I think what I’m trying to say (in my usual rambling style!) is that health issues can impact with weight gain. It puts strain on the joints - back, hips and knees for some people - and our hearts are the size of a fist big or small and so in a fat person our hearts have to pump harder to send blood to our extremities. This can exacerbate hypertension. Plus as explained to me recently a viscerally fat belly presses up inside against the lungs making a fat person more breathless when walking.

All in all, it ought not to be ignored. Even though I took my eye off the ball these last 3 years, it’s time now for me to address these issues.

This diet worked for me as well as Urmstongran and ayse. In my case I cut out sugar, wheat and dairy products as well as going low-carb and eating mainly fresh, unprocessed foods. This was advised by a doctor to deal with a problem of dizziness and fainting that I had. She thought it was caused by low blood sugar and low blood pressure and that this diet would help.

I went from nearly 12 st to 9 1/2 stone without restricting what I ate or being hungry at all. I just ate differently. The doctor was right about the diet sorting out the dizziness and fainting. I also felt much better and wasn’t hungry all the time like I had been before. I decided to just live on that diet.

I had had quite a healthy diet previously, without many processed foods, just too high carb for me.

I do think that individuals vary, as Professor Tim Spector says in his fascinating book The Diet Myth. So low-carb may not work for everybody.

I was talking about weight with my mother only yesterday. I was saying how it seemed so unfair that I should inherit the weight problems that she has always had while my brother and sister have inherited the leaner build that our father had. I have lipoedema, a condition that causes big legs and hips, as does my mother. I also have an underactive thyroid. Believe me, an overweight person is aware that they are too heavy. Serendipity, l am glad you have willpower but this is a very small part of the problem and does not mean that another person who struggles with willpower is weak - in fact the person who appears to have no willpower is often telling themselves how weak they are and what a terrible person they are as a result. Last year, l read a book called Why We Eat (Too Much) by Dr. Andrew Jenkinson. He is a bariatric surgeon who has actually listened and learned from his patients. Many of his findings are in concurrence with this article. One of the things I remember most was about the four-fold rise in obesity since 1980. There has been a corresponding four-fold rise in sugar consumption in this time. Many of the sugars are hidden in our food. Apparently, in the late sixties, scientists were trying to find the reason for the high rate of heart attacks. Cigarettes were already known but it became a two horse race between sugar and fat. The American sugar industry paid the authorities to "prove" that fat was the culprit and in the last forty years it has become the medical mantra. Unfortunately, low fat alternatives contain many chemicals that break down into carbohydrates and produce sugars. Dr. Jenkinson's conclusion is that butter, for example, is far better for you (and tastier) than low fat spreads full of chemicals.

I have a Charlotte Halston jacket that my husband bought me in 1980 it is size 12 I still wear it as I wear the cashmere coat he bought me a couple of years later it is a size 14. I have never been slim but am quite proud that I can still button up the coat and look fab in the red jacket.

With regard to POW survivors my late BIL came home from a Japanese POW weighing around the four and a half stone and was admitted to hospital in Edinburgh where he remained for over a year. He returned home to the Highlands and two year later married my late DH's sister. He was never a big man but worked away till he passed aged 62 and he drank a lot but worshipped his family. The thing I remember my DH telling me that he never allowed his four boys to leave a scrap on their plates which I think may account for the fact that three of them carry a lot of surplus weight.

that first article is a load of tosh

patrish

that first article is a load of tosh

Exactly what are your qualifications which enable you to make that judgement, please?

There is no such thing as being obese and healthy

I am no expert and this is just a comment. But I think that portion size has a lot to do with weight gain plus not listening to your body. Are you really hungry, for example? Or has it become habit to have three large meals a day at set times, especially when one is, like me, retired? I have always eaten little to no breakfast, even when younger, working and with young children and was busy. I still rarely have more than a small banana. Why? I am simply never hungry in the morning so I can’t see the point of forcing something down, even though we are lectured about it being the most important meal of the day. Similarly with lunch. Never that hungry, might have a yoghurt or piece of toast. In the evening I eat a small meal. My hungry time is later when I might eat a bar of chocolate, a packet of crisps, a sandwich or cheese and crackers or my favourite, yoghurt and muesli. I know I possibly have a smaller appetite compared to others but I rarely feel hungry with what I eat. When I see other members of my family, or when I eat out, I wonder at the huge platefuls of food they consume. With my own family, I think it’s habit. My parents were very food conscious and ate large potions. Both were overweight. I struggled with keeping up but was somewhat ridiculed if I didn’t. My sibling and her family kept up the tradition and are overweight now too. When I stay I’m astonished at how much and how often they eat! At 65 I am slimmer than I was at 18 with no effort other than listening to my body and only eating what I feel I need when I need it. And I deny myself NO treats whatsoever, I must add!

So what about skinny people who got fat by over eating. ? Which probably means many people can lose weight to become healthier...

Leggings have been my downfall. Back in the days when I wore jeans I knew straight away if I’d put on weight. But over the past few years my leggings just grow with me so I can ignore the fact that I know I’m eating too much.

HazelEyes

So what about skinny people who got fat by over eating. ? Which probably means many people can lose weight to become healthier...

Presumably their fat cells increased in number, then were lurking waiting to be filled up again

It is easy to put on weight and so hard to lose it. I was happy with my weight before pandemic. But for me going to Slimming World is the only way to get back to a slimmer me. I think it is worth the effort.

Urmstongran. I agree with you. I recently cut out sweets except for 1 or 2 square of 85% chocolate and I also cut out bread, buns, biscuits, cakes, cereal, etc. I was literally living on all this junk. I don't miss the sweets at all but I do crave bread so I'm allowing a bit of ciabatta now and again (more holes than bread ). I now tend to have far more veggies, but I still have meat and poultry (when I can afford it). I lost 8lbs in the first month. It's slowed down since then but still creeping on a downward slant so I'm not complaining.

GagaJo the health advice back in the 60's was very biased. The one that said that fat was bad for us was actually financed by the Sugar industry and we all know now how lethal sugar is.
One thing I do know for myself, is that trying to follow a diet that gives either 7, 14, 21 or 28 diet plan will fail at Day 3 because they give you fancy recipes that are expensive. Just eat simple meals. Eat more veg that grows on top of the ground rather than undereground (starchy), plenty of greens, steam and poach rather than deep fry and get off the sugar.