Being a long distance granny

I don't 'do' Facebook but am constantly amazed at how much trouble it causes with friends and families. However, on the subject of photos we've always made a point of having photos around the house of people that are no longer with us, because I realised that, as I grew up people I'd never met [some of them I'd met when very young so didn't remember] became part of my like because I'd grown up with an image of their face.

Defend away Gaga I did say 'they perhaps don't mean to be hurtful' didn't I? Though it's difficult to see anything kind or compassionate in the comment suggesting Hopeful was 'lacking in empathy'. I have personally found 'some people' far too liable to label people they do not know.

Actually, aka, I very carefully said that hopeful's comments suggested a lack of empathy to me. And that is what I meant, not that she lacked empathy, in response to her remark that my comments seemed, to her, to be harsh.

This is quite different from what appears to be your interpretation.

And, yes, I know some people may not see the distinction that I see, but some will, because it is real.

To get back to the story, it occurred to me yesterday that when I visit DD and my GSs, I'm the one taking photographs and putting them on FB and making them show up on DD's timeline as well. That's perhaps also why I'm puzzled by the initial complaint. So long as someone is taking photos...

And as others have said, if you want pics of yourself with the GKs, you hand someone your camera and ask them to take a pic for you.

I'm sorry hopeful has been feeling upset after her visit to her daughter, but I don't understand why she is upset from the story as told. I wonder if it was just post-visit lowness that I think many of us feel after loved ones go away again, or we go back home?

No, read it all again and I can't see the distinction.

Ah well, I know GNHQ is aware of the distinction and think it quite important, as do I.

We don't always understand why people feel as they do but that doesn't make their feelings less real. We are all different and feel differently about things but can empathise with the fact that they feel bad - if that makes sense.

Yes, it does make sense, wisewoman, and I did feel empathy for the daughter whose mother was complaining about her "bad behaviour". I don't know what the bad behaviour was and I'm very sorry hopeful was unhappy about it, but all I had to judge from was a number of complaints about the daughter and what appeared to me, from the words on the page, to be a lack of empathy from the mother.

Here are the things that influenced what I thought and what I wrote:

"she did behave rather badly"

"its like she has built this barrier around her and the only person who can make her smile is her husband"

" I know in that first week we were there if I could have got a flight home I would have gone"

"my daughters attitude made it very uncomfortable"

I'll say again, I'm sorry hopeful's visit caused her unhappiness, but the main message I got (possibly wrongly, but the post did suggest this to me) was that hopeful's comments were very critical of her daughter without really explaining why, and then complaining some more when she got home even though she had photographs of her own.

I guess what appeared to me to be the negativity of the post just got to me
because I cannot imagine that sort of scenario with my own daughter.

And I do know what it's like having a very critical and a very demanding mother.

Disclaimer: which is not saying that hopeful is either of those things, only that her post that I reacted to so disastrously seemed very critical to me.

Just as my post seemed harsh to her.

Hopefulnanny I too am not surprised your daughter was feeling stressed when you were there. You say she has two under five, one of them only four months old, and another on the way. She had you visiting, and your DH doing the house up round her!

Why did he do all that? Why did n' t you just have a pleasant visit seeing the place and being with them? And then let them do the jobs round the house in their own time.

Waste of a visit I think.

Don't blame her for being stressed. Quite understandable.

Actually j08 that would have been nice but it was at my daughters request that we do the house up not ours. We would have been more than happy to have just spent some down time with her and the grandchildren as if you had read the post you would see this was a hard trip to organise and this is why it was all the more upsetting. My husband was asked to do over and above what was agreed before we went out there and it took a lot of the hols up. Don't judge til you have all the facts . My dream would have been to just soak up the grandchildren and my daughter. As for the comments and justification of them by you thatsbag I am not even going to get caught up in it anymore. You have made it quite clear what you think of the way you perceive that I treated my daughter. You have obviously analysed all of this in your own head and come up with that conclusion but you are way off the mark. But as I said before I don't need to justify myself to you. I am neither a critical or demanding mother and take offence to that being mentioned. You obviously think that we have no right to feel hurt by our daughters and if we do we should not say anything. Once again the photo thing is consuming your thoughts. I really cant keep coming back to see your cutting remarks on this so I will thank all the ladies who have been understanding and offered empathy and wish them all well.

sorry Caga I just saw your comment. I can see nothing compassionate or kind about thatsbags comments and I really don't think she does worry that she causes hurt to others by her continual posts even after you had defended her. Hopefulnanny is leaving now and is "hopeful "that she doesn't encounter anyone like this again for sometime(sad)

There is everything kind and compassionate about thatbags. She is also clear, forthright and insightful.

Responding to comments made is not a personal attack, as she has clearly stated.

I've just re-read Hopefuls second post on this thread. I cannot understand why that should have provoked such a reaction from anyone. It was obviously written more in sorrow than anger.

* hopefulnanny* I think it is a case of walking a mile in someone else's shoes. Some can't do it . I have a daughter who has made me wonder why I have made the effort to stay and help out,who has not raised a smile and left me doubting my actions even though I have made enormous efforts to help. Not across the world but often with difficulties overcome. And yes I have appreciated that small children ,a very demanding job and a very focused husband makes her life to me seem like hell. So I not only sympathise but empathise with your predicament. I think plenty of people have said helpful things so stay to listen to others and I generally ignore lengthy posts where the poster needs to add to the post two or three times as if not to let in any other argument or other post.

That is a shame hopefulnanny. I hope you will reconsider. I like to think this is a place where we can come to offload so I'm sorry you feel this way. I don't have grandchildren living far away as many of you do but I do understand how difficult daughters can be and how their behaviour can sometimes defy rational explanation. It's a strange relationship between mother and daughter, as we have said many times on here.

I think we all realise what it can take it to "bare our souls" on GN or anywhere and admit things about our nearest and dearest which we would not articulate to friends who know them - especially our children whom we would defend to the death if anybody else criticised them. So while I am perhaps fortunate that I have not (as yet) experienced the disappointment hopeful went through, I - and I am sure all of us - can sympathise and offer some comfort. Just because it might not be your own personal response does not invalidate it. And I so agree with Tegan - Facebook causes more hurt than it is worth, I think especially among those of our generation because it highlights the often thoughtless behaviour and self-obsession of the young. It is too easy to "unfriend" a person without thinking through the pain that might cause or to fail to "like" a comment one person has made, but "like" everybody else's - thus making them feel neglected and left out. It is an appallingly inadequate means of communication not least because of the brevity and speed of comments which far too often provoke misunderstanding or pique.
I hope hopeful is still around to read this. One GNetter's opinion is as valid as another's - but it is the ones which criticise which sometimes seem to "stick", while there are plenty of others who can offer more sympathy.

Does anyone remember the thread about being kind. I think there was a blog or similar. Just as valid being kind to oneself.

I was once aware of holding high hopes and expectations of my long awaited visits. I'd parachute into my son's and daughter-in-law's lives once a year or 18 months or so if I was lucky. Over the years I've learnt to keep a completely open mind and to shelve any thoughts of an 'ideal' situation.
Every time I've visited it's been different, because their lives are constantly evolving, as the grandchildren grow, jobs come and go and financial issues shift. I'm constantly on a learning curve, and one I'm delighted to be on. I watch, listen and learn, try to suss it out a bit, but generally just muddle along, as they no doubt do with me.
I've never needed my visits to be a holiday. The visits are not always easy, and certainly not perfect, but all I need is just to be with them, as they are, for the short time I'm there. It gets better and better.

I wonder if anyone will 'bare their souls' on GN again, after what has been posted. It has just shown me that you can be really hurt by strangers which makes it worse.
I have not done it up to now ( because I haven't got any problems at the moment) but if it had a problem, I would keep it to myself. Putting such problems in a public domain means you have to be careful what you write about others who cannot defend themselves. 'Hopeful's daughter has been written about. I hope she doesn't read GN and recognise herself on it.

I think it is best not to stay with ex-pat family if you are going for a long holiday. Son/daughter and their wife/husband need some private time together and no-one with very young children needs the extra work of guests for a prolonged period. The German saying that after three days both fish and guests smell is a wee bit OTT, but there is an element of truth. When we visited absentdaughter for three months some years ago we stayed in a nearby motel. We spent the days with the family and ate together in the evenings but then we went "home" and left them some space.

Not the same situation i know, as I live only a one hour flight from my mother. Her longest visit is normally week and to be honest even that is a bit of a strain for me but I try very hard not to let it show. My visits to her are shorter.

I just don't find it easy to share my space with anyone for any length of time. I now understand that about myself.

The fact is that not everyone is able to analyse their own feelings far less articulate them. I know in the past I would get tense and edgy around my mother and think that somehow she made me feel that way. I now recognise that I just prefer my own space but I still would find it difficult to tell her that as she would be hurt.

I'm not at all sure we could get to the end of an extended visit on good terms.

I'm sorry you are upset hopefullnanny

It's a good idea if you can afford it absent but for many of us by the time we have scraped together the money for the fare spending a few more hundred on b and b is not an option and we have to make do with sofa beds, mattresses on floors etc.
No big surprise really that if someone is posting they are feeling vulnerable and hurt then they are going to be susceptible to feeling hurt and vulnerable about other things and other people. Comes with the territory.
You're right ffinochio - "go with the flow" is my motto. And it is not a holiday. Do get a tad peed off if people say"oh you are going on holiday again". No, even thougth I am lucky to be going, it is not a holiday. It's the only way I can see my children and grandchildren - it's a visit. I will try to fit in with their lives (whither thou goest this week, I will go too, DS2), or help out if need be. A holiday would be going away with DH and doing things we want to do together. It would certainly not be his idea of a break, spending a couple of weeks staying with my kids! And there has been a lot less of that since the kids emigrated.