Being apart from the grandchildren

Not allowing the children to talk to their GPs on the phone while they're in her care, knowing that her ex is more than capable of facilitating the relationship, is not "subverting the relationship". The GPs can accept that they need to have contact on their son's time.

If you read what the OP has posted Pnwmama you'll see that her son is maintaining her relationship with her GC.

The OP isn't expecting her ex d.i.l. to maintain that relationship, she doesn't want her to subvert it be refusing to allow her to talk to her GC on the 'phone.

Why is the ex dil expected to maintain the relationship? Does the son call his ex's parents and maintain their relationship with the grandchildren? Each adult child should maintain their family's relationships with the children.

Yes Hithere it is just a 'phone call.

Smileless,

It is not just a phone call.

That scenario assumes that ex dil can answer the call, has time to facilitate the call between the OP and gc or time to tell ex mil that is not a good time.

That scenario assumes the gc are available has no distractions so they can talk to grandma and they are in the mood to talk on the phone.

So no, just a phone call assumes availability of all parties involved.

Ex dil is the parent with the majority of custody in this case and I am pretty sure she has a thousand other things that have higher priority than being available on demand and drop everything when grandma calls.

But they are not.
The divorce has been over for two years. So this is they’re standard contact.

Could be ample but then again for the children as well as their GM maybe not, if the children are used to more frequent contact.

I think it would be ample for me but then again I have absolutely no contact with any of my GC and haven't had for more than 7 years, so anything would be a blessing.

Why? So far we have zero indication that these children are in anyway distressed. It is literally not the DILs problem

Well if he’s pulling his weight then twice a month is ample then

Perhaps one of the ex d.i.l's concerns should be allowing her children, if they want too, to have more contact with their GM.

From what the OP's posted the father is pulling "his weight in maintaining his families connections" and just as well.

And when she’s got a hundred other things to do. Or just wants to chill after work.
Do we even know the ages of the children.

So yes. It can be ‘that’ difficult.
How difficult would it be for their father to pull his weight in maintaining his families connections?

I agree. I wouldn’t doubt it swings both ways.
Everyone involved is only human.

However. Here it’s none of the ExDILs concern.

As I posted earlier it's just a 'phone call, not that difficult unless of course you want it to be.

Where have I or the OP suggested that the an ex m.i.l. has a call on how the ex d.i.l. arranges her time, calendar and schedule?

For goodness sake, what a lot of fuss about nothing. I wonder how many ex p's.i.l. are relieved when their AC get divorced that they have very little or nothing at all to do with their partners. Quite a few I would imagine.

Ex mil also doesnt have a call on how ex dil chooses to invest ex dil's time, calendar and schedule.

Well it’s her phone so of course she has the control.

Why does it have to be about control? I agree with referring too a mismatch of expectations but if we are going to bring control into the equation, who in this case has the control?

Not the OP that's for sure. Her ex d.i.l. wont let her talk to the children when they are with her; she has the control there doesn't she

This is again a case of mismatch expectations, with the GP having no control over what another adult does.

Just because you think another person should do this or that doesnt mean it is going to happen.

We'll just have to agree to disagree Bibbity and*Hithere*. While I acknowledge a divorced wife or husband's understandable desire for a clean break, that isn't possible when there are children involved is it.

Contact has to be maintained by the parents because they had children together. As for an ex i.l.; the 'phone rings, you answer, it's ex m.i.l. 'hello it's ....... can I speak too ......' answer 'yes I'll get .......' or 'sorry not at the moment, can you call (give another day, time or both'. It's not difficult is it and even if you could never stand your in law's and are glad to be free of them, do it for the sake of your children.

Smileless

This is the whole statement on the OP's second update
Ex dil is not preventing anything.

As for keeping the same frequency pre-divorce, it is not realistic.
The pre-divorce normal has changed and it is not the same as post-divorce normal.
It is obvious that the pre vs post reality has to adapt at all levels, including contact with extended relatives.

"For some reason my ex d.i.l will not let me Even talk to them, so I can only talk when they are with my son which is twice a month. "

OP does talk to her gc.

And also what you're referring to is woman’s work.
If the OPs son wishes his children to maintain contact the he can move to be near his children and do it.
The parent doing 100% of the hard work has enough on her plate.

Because it may be that the DIL needs a clean break.

I know a few people who’ve said the best thing about their divorce was never having the deal with the in-laws again.

I agree that the OP's ex d.i.l. "is well within her rights to protect and look after herself" Bibbity but if the OP and her GC were used to weekly contact, why create more disruption in the children's lives by stopping that.

If the OP's son cheated or is acting unreasonably that's not the fault of the OP's mother or the children, and should have no bearing on the mother's behaviour in this situation.

Maybe because the DILs whole life has been turned on it’s head. Once a week would be a ridiculous expectation.
Right now we don’t know the reason for the divorce. If he’s cheated or acting unreasonably then the DIL is well within her rights to protect and look after herself.

If you read the OP's second post Hithere you'll see that she has said "my ex d.i.l. will not even let me talk to them" so you see she is preventing them from talking to their GM.

She thankfully has no control over them talking to the OP when they're with their father but is preventing them from doing so when they're with her.

As for reasonable contact, that would depend on how often they had contact with the OP prior to the divorce. If that was twice a month as it is now, then the OP and her GC have not had their contact reduced.

If it was more often then that, say once a week then IMO that should stay the same. Why should the children's contact with their paternal GM be reduced, if that is the case, by their mother just because she's no longer her d.i.l.?

Good advice gagajo

Smileless,
"I don't agree that it's just your son's responsibility to enable you to maintain reasonable contact with your GC. When parents divorce, neither parent should prevent their former parent's in law from being able to at least talk to their GC."

1. What do you consider to be reasonable contact? It is a very subjective concept and what is reasonable for one person, it is not for the next

2. The ex dil is not preventing her kids from talking to OP at all. She is not telling her ex not to let the kids talk to grandma while the kids are in his care.

Good advice from tanith you could write to your ex d.i.l. and ask her if you can talk to the children at a time and day that suits her.

I don't agree that it's just your son's responsibility to enable you to maintain reasonable contact with your GC. When parents divorce, neither parent should prevent their former parent's in law from being able to at least talk to their GC.

Divorce is a confusing and stressful time for children, to a certain extent they 'lose' one of their parents when their parents are no longer living together.

I don't understand why some parents in this situation feel the need to exacerbate the children's sense of loss by preventing them from just talking to one set of GP's.

Have you thought about moving to be near your son? That way you would maybe get to see them once a month.

I would move heaven and earth to have a relationship with my grandson.