Your idea of stable??

It should be bl**ding obvious that the European countries with similar climate/lifestyles/population density to the UK still make mask wearing compulsory and have lower case rates.

Scotland?

Masks compulsory. Highest vaccination rate of any of the home nations; higher than Italy, France... Vaccine passports from next week. Good communications from the FM.

3 or 4 times the case rates of Spain, Germany, France and Italy. Its not as bl**ding obvious as some might think.

I think it’s partly about the ‘policing’ of the arrangements though Alegrias1, with the UK nations not being as rigid as some others. It’s also about the failure to vaccinate young people before the school term started again- I don’t know about in Scotland, but in Wales the rise was directly linked to the return to school.

If my daughter hadn’t ‘ve picked up her eldest son having covid on a lateral flow test the whole family would probably have been infected. And for those that think they don’t work she tracked the progress of his illness using the tests and they were very accurate.

I think you may be correct Casdon, especially about the vaccination of young people.

In Scotland the rise in cases started before the kids went back to school though, my guess would be people going to clubs etc when they opened up. Although the TRNSMT festival didn't cause a spike.

Which is why I get so blooming angry about the "wear face masks and open the windows" comments. Its more complicated than that.

MOnica just totally agree with every point you made on that post. We have to get back to normal and I hope some posters feel a bit reassured by your comments, & start to see people again (I'm not very sociable & don't live alone & didn't mind lockdown at first - but so many things I found easy pre-Covid are so difficult now - driving in traffic, public transport, socialising - many more months & I would have lost those abilities for ever I think)

Alegrias1

I think you may be correct Casdon, especially about the vaccination of young people.

In Scotland the rise in cases started before the kids went back to school though, my guess would be people going to clubs etc when they opened up. Although the TRNSMT festival didn't cause a spike.

Which is why I get so blooming angry about the "wear face masks and open the windows" comments. Its more complicated than that.

But it's not going to do any harm, is it?

Have you found out yet what's going on in schools? Or is it still hearsay?

Casdon

I think it’s partly about the ‘policing’ of the arrangements though Alegrias1, with the UK nations not being as rigid as some others. It’s also about the failure to vaccinate young people before the school term started again- I don’t know about in Scotland, but in Wales the rise was directly linked to the return to school.

The rise in England is directly related to the start of the school term too.

The UK is the third most obese nation in Europe. It's a factor.

www.thelancet.com/journals/langas/article/PIIS2468-1253(21)00190-4/fulltext

Is there a personality type that is more likely to include mask refusal?

For instance men, not well educated, shouty or stupid, disorganised or unimaginative life style.

The rise in England is directly related to the start of the school term too.

Is that corroborated by England only figures, growstuff?

I've been keeping a record of UK daily case numbers for well over a year now. when I look back to this summer the rise in case numbers seems to start towards the end of June. As do daily death numbers (though theoretically there should be a lag on those) The UK was into 30,000+ a day new cases by the beginning of July (as opposed to 5 -6,000 at the beginning of June.

Why would that be, I wonder? (I have no theory to offer)

Quite scary here in Trafford. Worst borough in Greater Manchester out of the 10.

Cases Up 17% a few days ago.
Bolton is at the bottom - cases up by 1%

No no no "MaizieD", it's obviously schools. Why would you even question that? Obvious, obvious.

Open the windows.

Alegrias1

No no no "MaizieD", it's obviously schools. Why would you even question that? Obvious, obvious.

Open the windows.

Our daughter teaches here in Trafford Alegrias. Mask wearing by staff again when walking through communal areas. Staff not to share the staff room at lunch. Kitchen ie toaster, microwave, kettle on a rota system again. She is quite anxious about it all. Double jabbed now but had Covid last September (pre vaccine roll out) followed by long Covid until Christmas, she said she had never been so poorly in her life and absolutely dreads catching it again. She puts on a brave face but is quite scared at these latest figures. Trafford has 746 cases now per 100,000 according to the Manchester Evening News.

Alegrias1

*It should be bl**ding obvious that the European countries with similar climate/lifestyles/population density to the UK still make mask wearing compulsory and have lower case rates.*

Scotland?

Masks compulsory. Highest vaccination rate of any of the home nations; higher than Italy, France... Vaccine passports from next week. Good communications from the FM.

3 or 4 times the case rates of Spain, Germany, France and Italy. Its not as bl**ding obvious as some might think.

Scottish children went back to school @2-3 weeks before English children. Might that be the reason why infection rates are higher in Scotland? And unlike those European countries they weren’t vaccinated.

Infection rates are no longer higher in Scotland, Scotland has the lowest rate per 100,000 in the four nations. It was the highest, now its not.

The high rate in August was driven by people aged 15-19 and 20-24. Not school age people who had not had the option to be vaccinated.

Urmstongran please don't think I'm minimising the situation in schools, I'm not doing that at all. I can't imagine how difficult it is for people who have to work there.

What I object to is strident amateur evaluations of what's happening and what the causes are, that cannot be questioned without triggering sarcasm and denial in the responses.

Well, given that the government no longer bother to give us up to date briefings about what is happening we have to attempt to work it out for ourselves.

GS1 tested positive on Thursday. His two closest friends had tested positive earlier in the week. All the rest of us have tested negative so SiL is still at work teaching, both younger boys are still going to school and DS is going to work. DD is not going to work because all the other research scientists she works with don't want to share a room with someone who has been in contact with Covid!

No, I know your not Alegrias.
No prob.
It’s just worrying us living here in Trafford!

Urmstongran

No, I know your not Alegrias.
No prob.
It’s just worrying us living here in Trafford!

Urmstongran

Quite scary here in Trafford. Worst borough in Greater Manchester out of the 10.

Cases Up 17% a few days ago.
Bolton is at the bottom - cases up by 1%

That’s interesting as Bolton were a hotspot area not too long ago. My daughter, age 35, got her vaccination earlier than her age group because she works in Bolton.

I also live in Greater Manchester, in Bramhall, Stockport, so we’re affected when extra measures were imposed last year.

In today’s paper, it says that almost half of new cases of people testing posting positive for Covid are in ages 12 to 16, ie Secondary ages children.

Can anyone tell me why this government didn’t insist on vaccinating secondary school age children in the summer holidays? As they did in France and Italy? (Apart from them being a bunch of muppets who didn’t want to annoy their anti vax wing? ) Every secondary school I know of has half the school off sick. The government have given up any pretence of insisting on public health measures to bring these figures down.

And what is the % uptake of these school kids themselves? By leaving the vaccination so late in the day in this group, did that have any effect on the "I'm invincible, don't need it, probably already caught covid" generation? Especially as it's the kids themselves making the choice.

I'm in contact with quite a few 11-16 year olds. Those already in Year 11 can't wait for the day they turn 16 because they can book through the national system. The younger ones have to wait until they can be vaccinated in school, unless they're CEV. None of the local state schools have started to vaccinate yet, although at least one private school has. Anecdotally, schoolchildren are impatient to be vaccinated. They're the ones who can see first hand how many pupils and staff are being infected and are having to take time off. They know that schooling and exams have been disrupted for older year groups and they don't want that for themselves.