Are British Men Scruffy In Their Clothes?

Since the employee wasn’t expected to work on Saturday and apparently only called in to get something as I understand it, it seems to me that the whole thing has been blown out of all proportion. Quite ridiculous in my opinion.

When you go to France or Italy you can always tell the Brits from the cheap ill fitting clothing. But strangely men in those countries don’t wear suits to weddings or funerals, which is about the only time Brits do.

Surely this amount of detail should not be on the internet for all to see re a current case of work place discipline. If the tee shirted guy saw it I would think he would have a justified complaint about his superiors.

mumofmadboys, in regard to your post @07:25 today, you or anyone else on this forum do not know the name of the company or its exact location.

You also do not know me or my real name, the name of the employee involved or the names of any other person involved in this matter.

No doubt as the confrontation was witnessed by several others it has been discussed widely outside the company and possibly on social media already.

How then could this employee bring any charges against anyone when it is an employment situation that occurs in any number of companies every day.

Working life can be a stressful experience for people at any time, and confrontations will occur and will be talked about, it's as simple as that.

No one has yet stated if this young employee is at this point guilty of any misdemeanour at this point, only what the circumstances seem to be that surround this matter.

Also surely if matters such as this are not seen as open for discussion on this forum, the much more private matters of allegations against others in personal relationships should also not be discussed?

Anyway, I am off to the office now where doubtless it is the top topic of conversation outside of the work at hand and that no one can attempt to stop.

It’s always been the same, we just haven’t necessarily noticed!?

Are British Men Scruffy In Their Clothes?
Just replace British with any other nationality in the world and the answer would of course be the same. Many are, many aren’t.

My opinion on the OP’s particular situation is that I wouldn’t normally see a problem with an employee calling in at his place of work when off duty, wearing jeans and a tee shirt. The offensive slogan, however, is a different matter. That’s so disrespectful.

Maggiemaybe
Unless the young man was expecting to see a client on the Saturday in question and I wonder if that was likely anyway, as he is a trainee, popping in on Saturday when he wasn't expected seems to be beyond the call of duty and shows conscientiousness.
Wearing jeans when just calling in for a short while en route to perhaps somewhere else wouldn't really seem to be a problem but I agree the t shirt was offensive. I can't imagine older men wearing that kind of thing in any situation, unless he's an elderly rocker!

Does the trainee normally dress appropriately?
The office manager told him off in front of others which probably embarrassed him, he was rude and the office manager reacted inappropriately.

It could have been handled better by taking him on one side, thanking him for coming in but reminding him of the dress code even at weekends, quietly and not in front of other staff.

Will we hear the outcome?

What a sensible post Callistemon. Just how I think it should have been dealt with by the employer.

For those showing interest in the case of our young employee, it has now become clear that it has been events outside the company in the employee's life which became the trigger for the happenings in our offices on Saturday morning.

He requested of his line manager (The Assignment Team Controller) on Tuesday of last week if he could have Thursday and Friday off as holiday being it was his Birthday. He was informed that the request was rather late in coming, but it was granted. The foregoing left the team short on personnel and in that they were unable to fully complete an incident investigation at a sewage treatment plant on Friday in a reasonable time, which meant that the team would be required to work on Saturday in the office.

However, our employee had gone out with some friends to celebrate his birthday on the Thursday evening and while in a restaurant he had a couple of glasses of wine. On driving out of the car park later he then had a minor vehicle accident with another car. On exchanging details with the other driver, he was asked if he had been drinking, to which he responded by being verbally abusive and driving off in his car.

By the time he arrived home, the police were waiting for him and he was breathalysed taken to the station where he was eventually charged with driving while under the influence of alcohol and drugs. In the forgoing, he was then held by the police until mid-morning Friday, by which time by his own admittance his mind was in "absolute turmoil".

In the meantime, he had been emailed by his line manager that the Assignment team would be working in the office on Saturday commencing at 8:30 am to which he arrived at 9:20 wearing the now-famous Tee-Shirt which triggered all the events already discussed in this thread.

He was suspended over the incident in the office pending a grievance and possible disciplinary hearing against him. However, when I arrived in the office this morning he had contacted the company requesting a "personal meeting" in regard to his situation. That I granted and took that meeting at lunchtime in the company of one of our Legal Secretaries who would act as note taker and witness.

It was at that meeting that all the events of the drink driving etc were disclosed to us as his employer. I reminded him it was part of his contract of employment with us that he would always be required to hold a current UK driving licence. I then suggested that the best way forward for him and us as his employer may well be for him to resign from our employment prior to the hearings tomorrow (Thursday) as that would allow us and him to state he had left our employment of his own volition and with a clean record.

The above he accepted with immediate effect and has now left the company. My thoughts on this matter I will not state, but they in no way would include the word sympathy.

I think it’s utterly unprofessional of you Grandad to have disclosed all this information about the former employee on a public forum which is easily accessed by anyone in the world.

If anyone recognises this situation it could be your job on the line, Grandad. I firmly agree with maddyone.

The discussion about mens' style of dress was quite interesting and enjoyable until this long inappropriate post.

I’m totally shocked and disgusted at such a disclosure against a staff member. Completely agree with maddyone and others.

Totally out of order Grandad1943 unless of course it's all a work of fiction.

maddyone, in regard to your post @18:50 today, as I commented earlier in the thread, you do not know me personally or my name or the name of our company.

You are also in unaware of the exact location of the company or the name of the former employee, in fact, yourself and other forum members are only aware of what I have stated on this forum.

I am aware that the matter has already been discussed on social media by members of our staff some of whom were aware of the true facts of the situation before I and the other partners in the business were today.

Therefore I will ask the same question again, that being, how can it be that highly detailed descriptions and allegations can be made and revealed in regard to personal relationships which can be highly damaging and distressing to others in those partnerships and families if recognised, and yet discussion on someone who in his working and private life as caused actual physical danger to others, is viewed by you as offensive and taboo.

This person endangered others in his actions but has fortunately only wrecked his working and personal life in the outcome. In that, I have no sympathy for him, but great sympathy for others in our employ who he brought great distress to over the weekend.

sodapop Quote [Totally out of order Grandad1943 unless of course it's all a work of fiction.] End Quote.

You can of course believe or not believe whatever you read on this forum. I very often think that many of the personal stories revealed on here are "a work of fiction".

However, this one is not as such, and I only revealed the outcome as a forum member had enquired as such. ?

If you cannot see that you have disclosed personal information on the internet, which can be accessed by the whole world, then obviously anything I or others say will not change your mind Grandad. It is highly unprofessional, and even it is true that others have also shared this information on Social Media, I’m afraid it does not absolve you of abusing the employee’s right to confidentiality. We may not know his name, but perhaps his grandma, mother, auntie, or one of many other of his family/friends reads Gransnet and will recognise the situation. What will happen then I wonder? Will your employers take kindly to you and other employees writing about this on Social Media?
Whatever, you obviously do not recognise any problem in what you have done. Frankly, I’m not surprised.

sodapop, spot on - a work of fiction, and contradictory to boot. In the original post, he was 'not officially working'!

When I asked Will we hear the outcome? I expected to hear that everything had been resolved amicably in a meeting before a disciplinary meeting, apologies from both parties and a resolve to put it all behind them.
Or yes, lessons have been learned and we will move on from that incident.

I'm shocked and really wish I hadn't asked now.

maddyone Quote [ Will your employers take kindly to you and other employees writing about this on Social Media? ] End Quote.

maddyone, you keep repeating the above seemingly in the hope that I will be disciplined in some way. However, what you obviously do not realise that I and my wife launched this business in 2003 as our own, and are now joint owners with two other partners who we sold a share of the business to in 2013 when I thought I was going to retire. ?

Agree with sodapop and Hetty58 end of

Callistemon, yes life is often not as we would wish it, and often there are things we wish we were not aware of and did not have to deal with.

But that is not life, unfortunately.

Well that’s alright then isn’t it? Because you are the employer it’s perfectly acceptable to put all of this information on the internet about one of your employees. In actual fact as the employer you have greater responsibility towards your employees. The arrogance is simply astounding. You simply have absolutely NO understanding that your behaviour is unprofessional in the extreme. Sad!

maddyone, please inform me of the name of the company involved in this incident. My name, the name of the person who has brought this event on himself or the name of any other person/employee involved in the this matter.

If you cannot then it is proven that you are aware in reality of absolutely nothing that could be damaging to anyone in regard to this situation.

Every member of this forum posts under the cloak of anonymity and that allows all to discuss many matters that could not be openly discussed under any other circumstance.

That is the basis of this forum and much of other open social media.

I think it's called "duty of care in the workplace" maddyone and is a legal requirement for employers.