Children in pubs

I suspect European children may be far more used to sitting at a table with the rest of the family to eat and being included in the conversation, as a mealtime is more of a family occasion. Sadly, there’s a lot of eating in front of the television now.

I’ve always taken the children and now grandchildren out to eat in cafes, restaurants and pubs. We (the family) think it’s important they learn all the skills associated with eating in company and taking others into account.
However, you do have to fit the experience with the ages of the children, take things to occupy them and be prepared to take them elsewhere or leave if behaviour deteriorates due to tiredness and boredom. It is a good way for children to try new foods but be prepared for them to be rather overwhelmed and eat very little or lots of chips, for example.
I believe that children are generally badly behaved because of insufficient supervision and parents who allow their child ren to run about unsupervised are a pain in the .......
It’s all a matter of balance.

That's sadly very true *Daddima. We were fortunate that Mr. S. never worked far from home so we could sit down every evening for a family meal.

When we took them out for meals they were generally well behaved and we wouldn't have allowed them to disturb other diners by running around and making a nuisance of themselves.

It's the parents who are at fault. If they don't want to engage with their children, why take them with them.

A pub is a pub - it's a place where alcohol is served and irrespective of whether families deserve time together to relax, if they choose to do it in a pub then the children should be properly supervised because a pub can be a dangerous place, especially if drinks are being carried to a table by a waiter or another customer. Pubs that declare themselves as 'child-friendly' have play areas and responsible parents would position themselves near such places so as not to inflict their children on others. Personally, I love kids but if I were disturbed by the sound of a loudly-bleeping tablet on the next table regardless of who was using it, I would ask them to turn the sound down, wear headphones or move.

You just have to find a pub that isn't full of squawking kids. My husband can't cope with noise - it sets his leg off - but we're lucky that our local has a quiet bar away from the restaurant. Three-year-old granddaughter knows how to behave herself.

The problem I think isn't having children around but the lack of courtesy on the side of their parents. We took my two children out in the evenings once a month for pizza - they were expected to sit at the table, not run around shouting or disturbing anyone else. I have noticed that, quite often, the parents ignore the noise their children are making and it is that that so annoys. I have been out for evening meals in France and Belgium where children have been at the table with their parents and families - never have I seen the children running riot, shouting or making a disturbance. It is not unreasonable to want to have your meal in peace - we are all paying the same price for our food after all. Children can be taught to behave when out, it is just a question of their parents taking the time to bother to do it - not the fault of the children themselves.

We have a different approach here. Any establishment that calls it's self a pub or bar, children are not allowed. If you are a pub/bar style restaurant children are allowed. So this gives adults the break from kids if they want to hit a pub.
I can appreciate both sides. It is nice to get out and not have children running wild, but on the flip side, it is nice to be able to bring your children along for a family outing.
I feel we should be putting pressure on parents to "control" their children, after all it is a respect thing out in public if you ask me.

Totally agree with GoldenAge
The same applies in restaurants and the public areas in Gyms.

I have been disturbed by noisy groups of young women shrieking and swearing more often than I have been disturbed by children in pubs.

I imagine it is all about the horrors of Prince Doo-dah kissing SB without a signed letter of consent. Talk about first world problems. I think even small children know that fairy tales are not real.

On the subject of children not being shown things for which their parents have not given permission for them to view, my grown up children laugh helplessly at the following story:-

When I was teaching and they were at a lovely childminders they were allowed to watch a film every so often and took it in turns to pick one. I was very strict about what they could see at home and fought many battles over, for instance, films like 'Jurassic Park' which I forbade but which all their peers had seen.

At the time they gave me 'edited' versions of what they viewed. All wholesome, of course.

Years later they told me that my DS chose 'Jurassic Park', Terminator' and the like (he was nine, she was seven) and she chose 'Cinderella'. Every single time.

I don't know who was more traumatised. My poor girlie hiding behind the sofa at the scary bits or my DS having to see 'Cinderella' fifty times.

I nearly died when they told me years later but they both seem to have survived and they think it is simply hilarious.

I imagine a child might just survive watching Disney's 'Sleeping Beauty'. Maybe they could have a trigger warning and a counselling session afterwards.

I think the problem is lazy, inconsiderate parents. If they take their kids to the pub for a meal and a few drinks fine but make sure you include them, watch them and don’t allow them to run riot and disturb other people. Your kids, your responsibility.

We took my cousin (93 and fairly deaf) to a local restaurant for lunch. It was quite full, and the couple at the next table who had two children allowed them to run about shouting the whole time we were there, scraping chairs across the stone floor until everyone within earshot - the entire restaurant I should think - had teeth on edge. We gave up after one course and left - my cousin couldn't cope with the noise. I can't think it was beyond them to at least try to get the children to sit down; we always took colouring books etc. and did our best not to wreck everyone else's meal. It's a really good thing to take children out to eat but not at the expense of others who might be having a special treat wrecked.

My view is that children should be in a separate area WITH their parents. Some people seem to think that there’s nothing wrong with family’s being out for the evening. I don’t have a problem with that as long as the children are well behaved and sat in the family eating area. I think it’s quite selfish for some to say what about them being able to have a good time. The “don’t care about anyone else” parents really bug me.
Don’t say you can’t afford a babysitter, as that would be the cheapest option, sure the cost would be covered with having no kids to feed!

I find the US/ English attitude to children as part of a family quite sad at times. We all need time without one another I know that. But some people view kids as an alien species.

PECS I don’t view kids as an alien species and do take the dgc out when we are on holiday. They can behave!! However, we cannot afford to go out often, and when we do go out for a treat the last thing I want is having rude and unruly children, whose parents couldn’t care less about anyone else but their party, running around spoiling my night out.

I find it strange that people take their children to pubs especially on a Friday/Saturday night. It is irritating for those of us that want a nice relaxing drink. The kids are bored, but the parents don't care. So selfish.

KatyK lots of restaurants in the Lakes are dog friendly. They know which side their bread is buttered. My dog stays under the table, you wouldn't know he was there. As for children picking their noses and wiping it on the table is unhygienic.

Everyone seems to thinks we should put up with children's bad behaviour. We were rarely taken out to eat when young but always had to sit nicely at the table until finished. It certainly did not harm us.

The notice in a pub I was in the other day made me smile it read CHILDREN ARE WELCOME HOWEVER NOISY UNRULY CHILDREN WILL BE PUT INTO A PIE THANKYOU

I everyone. I was living on Malta being the Mediterranean area where you take your children out, with you, unless specifically requested, none. Most are pretty well behaved I think because they’re introduced to going out at a very early age.p, the waiters and restaurant staff rebuke if necessary, don’t think parents here will allow that.
However there is always one! Some parents today think the children will morph by themselves into acceptable behaviour, I shudder to imagine these unruly kids will be as teenagers.

Unfortunately, as many posters on this thread have pointed out, some parents take their children out and then proceed to ignore them. The children then behave badly and annoy other diners. Hardly surprising. No parent should allow their child/children to behave badly ie noisily, run around, upset other diners, unfortunately if they do, it gives the wrong message to the children who then grow up to disrespect other people, and it spoils the dining experience for other customers who may not be able to afford to eat out very often themselves!

Children should behave well, and it’s up to parents to ensure they do. We took our own children out when they were small and they always behaved well, they were well aware of our expectations. And we often dine out with our grandchildren who also always behave well, despite their very young age. That is because their parents ensure they behave well and also provide crayons, books etc.

Continental children do dine out with their family, but the expectation is that the children behave properly. That is why it is perfectly pleasant to dine out abroad even when children are out quite late with their parents. And because the expectations of some British parents are so low (thankfully only some parents) that is the reason that sometimes dining out in Britain is a distinctly unpleasant experience.

PECS how many continental countries have you been out eating late in the evening. I have experienced 7 different as well as Japan, Thailand, Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia. I have never seen children behaving how they are allowed to in the UK. Speaking with a lot of people in those countries about their children being out later in the evening and almost being invisible I have been advisedby many that children are allowed to be children up to what we would regard as tea/dinner time 6 - 7 pm but after that they are with adults and if they want to be given that priviledge then they have to accept they have to behave by joining them and taking part in the group. This then helps the children to understand how to behave around adults and socialise. We don't seem to do that here, probably too much work for some and the current thinking of children should be allowed to express themselves no matter how intrusive on others.

I live in a European country and find the attitude of Brits in the UK to children in pubs and restaurants mystifying.
We don’t really do babysitters, so always go out with our DS to restaurants and bars (not pubs) and sometimes stay out till ooh 9.30 and it’s not a problem at all, completely normal. Here, the necessity to have ‘adult drinking time’ is just not so pervasive. And I like it much better. I like hanging out with our DS! And he loves eating out. I personally never had a meal in a restaurant until I was 17! So I would say things have changed in our world but maybe not yours OP!

The worst case we encountered of bad behaviour in a restaurant (not a bar!) was when we stayed at a well-reviewed and expensive hotel/restaurant on the south coast for a special anniversary. From one large party there was continuous calling out and wandering from table to table. Food, which had obviously been carefully prepared and presented, was being carried around and waiters impeded. Our long-anticipated fine dining experience, and that of other diners who had no doubt similarly looked forward to their evening out, was completely ruined. We had travelled hundreds of miles for this appalling behaviour. Yet there wasn't a child in the party! How adults think it's acceptable to wear beach wear in any restaurant is beyond me, but the behaviour and lack of consideration for other diners was astounding. These, of course, are the same parents who have no problem with their children wandering around in a restaurant. When we complained the waiter apologised and said had they known the party would be so bad-mannered they would have served them in a separate outside room as it was also bad publicity for the restaurant. But, obviously, they could not really do anything then as there were about 40 guests involved.

As for children, I think a bar is an inappropriate place for them, but they definitely should learn the enjoyment of eating out with their parents, as long as said parents put away their phones and talk to their children!

Dogs are a different matter. Having been penned into our table by 2 extremely large dogs lying on the floor, on a visit to a local cafe-bar lately, I was already quite annoyed when the waitress serving food patted them. We won't be going back! Surely basic hygiene, which seems to be going downhill in most restaurants lately, should prevent dogs from being taken into eating establishments. Don't get me started on how long we seem to spend clearing tables before we eat... Grumpy old woman alert!

That's interesting justwokeup - I have noticed several dogs in various eating establishments recently and was quite surprised. They were not guide dogs.
I'm assuming that, if there ever were any rules against bringing dogs into cafes or restaurants, they have been relaxed or abandoned.

Me too Jalima. I was in a very nice restaurant in Chester yesterday; it was very busy with every table occupied and very little room to squeeze between the tables. At the table next to us were a young family; parents, 2 small children and a pug dog. The children were very well behaved. The dog was not. It was tied to the table leg by its lead and every time a waiter tried to walk past, with plates of hot food and drinks, the dog ran out from under the table, yapping and and yelping at them. The owners gave an occasional tug on the lead but otherwise it ignored it. But worst of all was the snorting and snuffling from the wretched beast. It snorted and snored constantly, like it had a heavy cold and was really off putting when youre eating a meal. Pugs never were my favourite breed of dog but having had to sit next to them in a restaurant and listen to them when im eating has made me dislike them even more. Dogs should not be in restaurants imo.