Beggars CAN be choosers!

Ah good point Ana ! I didn't think of that.

Like Anniebach I always give cash, I realise I'm ignoring all the guidelines.
There but for the grace of God goes one of mine.

I think you can believe there but for the grace of whoever whilst giving coffee/sandwich. I would just feel bad ignoring the advice of those I admire for the work they do and who' give advice based on their experience and knowledge.

I always bought a sausage roll and coffee, until it was thrown back at me one day.

I asked the man in question what he did want? ' A can of Special Brew to take the pain away' so I gave him the money and the pigeons ate the sausage roll.

Oh dear - thrown back at you? I don't think I could cope with that at all which I appreciate may not reflect well on me.

mary of course you won't have seen these signs in my town centre unless of course it's suddenly become a national trend

I do know what Annie means that it's a bit of a losing battle not giving them money as somehow or other they'll get it anyway. You can't stand between an alcoholic and their drink - I know that from my father and my sister - but I'd no sooner have offered my sister a drink than give money for that purpose.

My money my choice. Annie's money so her choice I'd have to add.

We are speaking of people who have sunk as low as anyone can . We don't know why or know what life has thrown at them .

I said charities didn't have the money to care for them all and am accused of criticising the charities.

If this help is so readily available how come there are so many alcoholics on the streets? There is not enough of money , may be in the Thames Valley , quite an affluent part if the country? but not country wide. This is not a criticism it is a fact.

Annie both you and I know that charities can only provide help for those that want it. I have enormous admiration for those who manage to stay dry (I'd like to say 'recover' but that's not really possible) but they are few and far between.

Alcoholism is pretty much acquired through a genetic predisposition and tends to run in families. It certainly does in mine. But it is so, so hard on family members and I cannot blame anyone who eventually gives up on an alcoholic who just throws everything back in their face, promises everything, delivers nothing but pain, embarrassment and heart ache.

Sorry for venting,

I didn't mean to imply that the help is easily available - I was making the point that charities dealing with homeless people may well offer rehab facilities as well when you said they didn't - you made a bald not qualified statement. There is no way that the charities could meet all the needs and as has been said, people have to want to be helped in the first place. I agree that someone who is desperate for a drink will get one somehow - I was just saying that my position is that it won't be through me - others make their own choices obviously.

Anya - hugs , It a bugger isn't it

Maryeliza, do you know how many rehab centres in the country ? how long the wait is to get a place ? Do some research .

Yes what I do with my money is my choice, the high moral ground isn't the place for me. Do I want to buy an alcoholic a Drink? NO, do I want them curled up on the pavement with abdominal pain or stiff as a board whilst having a convulsion ? NO , do I want them to steal ? NO

I don't know why you are getting so irate anniebach. You posted this Do these charities provide drying out clinics? No because they are are too costly. This is not a factual statement - some of the charities do provide some rehab facilities. As I have already posted, I am fully aware ( without doing research) that the facilities available are totally inadequate and that is a government not charity failure anyway. I don't appreciate you ordering me to do some research by the way. This started off as an interesting discussion - those of us who do not give money are not taking the high moral ground but stating a position that we genuinely hold - those of you who give money have said why. Two sets of opinions with with reasons given -I think disagreements are allowed

Sadly these people who have for what ever reason got to this very sad state will definitely crave the alchol over food or anything else. Their is no easy answer, it takes almost one to one interaction 24/7. No council or charity can sustain that help . Volunteers do all they can , but it will never be enough to help everyone who has ended up this way , so I guess the best we can do is try to talk to them when we give them money or food,ask them to be honest ,try to reach them truthfully & if they never make it, they will have at least experienced someone stoping to care, but sadly most will be past that & just want their next fix

We no longer have any beggars in our town centre (well certainly not in the daytime) so it doesn't arise However I do support the Sally Army who do a lot of good work with the homeless
We did have a young man sleeping rough in the shop doorways outside the town centre he was given blankets, sleeping bags, food and coffee by residents daily he was also offered a council flat which he declined I don't know where he is now
I would never give money now since I ve had a more realistic view of how it is spent as that truely helps no one least if all the person it is conluding with their addiction

Good understanding norose,

May I say to all, no one decides - I will be an alcoholic, no one knows when they take that first drink if they will become an alcoholic or not.

And no one on here is showing anything but compassion but compassion needs to be about not colluding with someone's addiction

Yes anniebach I think most of us understood that and I agree with BlueBelle about compassion not necessarily meaning collusion.

I follow the advice of the various charities for the homeless - don't give beggars money, give it to the charity. My daughter used to work for a pizza restaurant when she was at college. One evening they had cooked more pizzas than were needed, and she took one out to a beggar outside. His response was 'I don't eat pizza'. Her response was 'Well, you can't really be hungry then!'.

I was told this by someone who worked in a bank,
A lady gave sandwiches to someone begging, he promptly broke up the sandwiches in front of her and fed them to the pigeons . He obviously wanted cash !

For me, if I give someone cash, that's the end of my involvement with that cash. The giving of it is my charitable act, and the money then belongs to the person who receives it. What they choose to do with it from then on, is up to them. I don't think I have the right to say - well here's some cash but you can only spend it on things that I approve of.

If they are homeless, then from my understanding they cannot claim benefits as you need a permanent address. And if they are on the street during the day, the chances are that they are not employed. So if they have an alcohol or drug problem, the only way they are going to get money to fund that addiction, (without people giving them cash) would be to steal. If my giving someone cash is saving someone else from being robbed, then I'm really ok with that.

Of course, the ideal would be for the person to manage their addiction, but we all now how savagely these types of services have been cut, and the help isn't always there.

Like many things 'begging' has got out of hand. There are obviously genuine homeless people who need help and giving them healthy food can help. A friend of mine who lives in London once asked a beggar what he wanted in his sandwich, he requested a complicated and expensive choice from the M and S range! My friend bought it but vowed never again. A documentary once followed a beggar home he caught a train and at the final destination drove off in a car. Makes you think. I never give money to beggars (occasionally food) but I often give to buskers as I enjoy their efforts.

I agree HurdyGurdy

I once read a report, compiled by a large charity, which said that some rough sleepers, 'woke in the morning covered in sandwiches' where people were leaving them too much food.

What is really need is better food, not much nutritional value in a sandwich really. Donate to your local soup kitchen or shelter or food bank, where hot food and other support are available.

Many beggars have houses, cars and a decent lifestyle, and just as many don't and need proper support that coffee cannot provide.

I once offered a "beggar" a packet of biscuits. He looked at me as if I was totally mad and rejected them on the grounds that he had "to fink of is teef", adding that what he needed was money.
Last year in freezing weather I went out of my way to buy/give a couple of males who looked desperate a large, hot sausage roll each, but one actually said no-one would give him money while he was eating that!!
It makes me feel very sad and guilty that I have enough while some appear to have next to nothing.

Sadly they want cash for drink or drugs. Can't tell you how many times I've seen these " beggars" handed car keys by their friend who has come to take over the next shift. Cynical I know but sadly that's life. It a job to most of them and they make a good living out of it too. They don't want sandwiches!