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MSM is not Main Stream Media any more

(11 Posts)
abbey Mon 30-Jan-17 14:37:48

MSM was originally the Multi Store Model of memory.

Penstemmon Sun 29-Jan-17 20:59:21

thatbags I totally agree that too much emphasis can be put on some research where the 'conclusions' are less tranferable to human responses/conditions.

I have not had time to listen to the podcast today but will find a time tomorrow.

I like Ben Goldacre's articles.

thatbags Sun 29-Jan-17 12:51:14

PS please note, I'm not saying the research about the stuff on burnt toast was unnecessary, but that the advice extrapolated from the research was. This is an important distinction to make. So far as I'm concerned, people can research what the hell they like (that's science, right?) if they can afford to do it out of their own funds or can persuade others to pay for it.

It's not the research that's the problem, but the "advice".

thatbags Sun 29-Jan-17 12:48:33

Are you suggesting is that FSA is giving unnecessary /wrong/poorly researched advice to the public?
Answering your last question first, pen: yes, I do think the FSA is giving unnecessary/poorly researched advice to the public.

Do you think there is space for any organisation/quango to filter/review scientific research so that the 'good & well informed'outcomes from research are properly mediated to the general public?
If yes: who should it be?
If No how will the general public know what research has found out?

This set of questions is harder for me to answer. I'll have a go. I think all medical trials should be published, even (possibly especially) ones with negative results as well as the ones with positive results because otherwise researchers and policy wonks (not an insult; I just can't be arsed to go looking for a different word; that one sprang to mind) cannot accurately judge what advice to give to the medical and related professions. Ben Goldacre, being far more knowledgeable on the subject, argues this far better than I can.

Based on that, then I see no harm in the publication of all scientific experiments, at least the ones paid for by the public. What I see harm in is rubbish conclusions being drawn from badly conducted experiments or those done with far too small a sample or those which, as in the roast spuds and burnt toast examples, are based on unnatural amounts of the 'harmful' substance being given to rodents and then the necessarily ridiculous results being extrapolated as applying to human beings who might occasionally ingest miniscule, harmless amounts of the same substance, and come to no harm whatsoever. The spikedonline podcast I refer to claims that this is what has happened.

They also argue that it is not the job of the FSA to nannify our lives over very small insignificant risks. I agree.

If you listen to the podcast you might also be convinced, or at least see where I and the podcast speakers are coming from, in thinking that quangos like the FSA have gone far beyond their original andnuseful remit and now seem to justify their existence in ridiculous ways. The podcasters argue that there should be funding reviews of such bodies annually, where they have to justify the importance of their next year's (or years') work to the health of the nation. That sounds to me like a good idea. I din't know who would do the reviews, but presumably there do exist bodies capable of such stuff. I'm thinking of NERC, for instance.

I hope that answers your questions. The podcast will probably answer them better.

Penstemmon Sun 29-Jan-17 12:15:48

Some questionss thatbags

Do you think there is space for any organisation/quango to filter/review scientific research so that the 'good & well informed'outcomes from research are properly mediated to the general public?
If yes: who should it be?
If No how will the general public know what research has found out?
Are you suggesting is that FSA is giving unnecessary /wrong/poorly researched advice to the public?

thatbags Sun 29-Jan-17 08:38:52

I don't want to ban rubbish science. Don't get me wrong. Success in science is built upon piles and piles of failure. What I want to discourage is the spending of public money by quangos on health nonsense when there is so much important health stuff to spend the money on.

thatbags Sun 29-Jan-17 08:36:34

Another serious point is that the Food Standards Agency, which was set up on the back of the BSE crisis, a real threat to human health with actual evidence, is now havering on about the totally unproven risks associated with fluffed and roasted spuds and burnt toast. It's ridiculous and should be stopped. Complete waste of public money.

Rubbish science is bad for human health.

thatbags Sun 29-Jan-17 08:26:41

On the serious side, the discussion group in the podcast is talking about using the money that they think is wasted by quangocrat organisations (Health England in this case) on more important health projects, like the NHS.

thatbags Sun 29-Jan-17 08:24:05

Joke, mawbroon! JOKE! wink

New word of the day: quangocrat.

MawBroon Sun 29-Jan-17 08:18:26

confused ?

thatbags Sun 29-Jan-17 08:07:47

but More Sugar Madness.

Anyone got any other suggestions for reappointing acronyms?

BTW, you might want to listen to this spikedonline podcast, which is where I got the new meaning from: No, roast potatoes don't give you cancer.