Is wolf-whistling a sex crime?

Your prerogative, but in the interim while we're waiting for things to possibly, maybe, perhaps change, we have to deal with the reality.

I thought the word Neanderthal summed it up well; however Neanderthals were probably a lot more civilised than we give them credit for. Perhaps sexist - I was going to say pigs but is that the wrong term? - would be more appropriate.

I think this type of behaviour has gone way beyond a wolf whistle as was reported in the headlines and I agree would seem to be on the increase. It may be because of the increase in online porn etc which is objectifying women - and men- which was not available years ago.

I'll carry on shouting from the rooftops rather than simply accepting disgusting behaviour

There will always be unreconstructed Neanderthals, doesn't matter what's done to educate them. That's the reality, no matter how much shouting from the rooftops is done.

(Quote) "I want to live in a democratic society but I don't ever want to be offended again,"

Further to my post about not minding wolf whistles as a young teenager I did have other experiences that I found upsetting.

One was having to take my turn to buy mid morning snacks for the office. The cafe was a horrible place heaving with sweaty men all eating bacon sandwiches. I had to push my way through the crowd to the accompaniment of often lewd comments from the blokes.

I used to really dread going there but in those days there was no-one to talk to about it.

Eloethan and JessM great posts

I am really surprised that some people think the behaviour of those on the building site is OK.

* A group of men making sexual comments to a single women for a month.
* A least one action which was intimidating.
* Reported to the appropriate authorities
* They contact employers who gave warnings to those involved.
* It stopped.

Why support such Neanderthal behaviour while blaming the victim who had done nothing wrong but had, in fact, followed the correct route.

I can remember explaining to my son at 16 that even walking towards a women on her own with a large group of his friends could seem intimidating to a women in some circumstances - at night, in lonely places for instance, and to be aware of how others are made to feel by seemingly innocuous behaviour. I would have thought these men were very aware of how powerful their group behaviour would be. Indeed I imagine that is why they enjoyed doing it.

I suspect that young women these days are subject to a nastier kind of attention in the streets than we experienced. "Laddish" vulgar, porn-inspired behaviour has become more acceptable.
I offer the website Everyday Sexism as my evidence. There you can read thousands of first hand accounts and I urge you all to go there, read ask yourself would you like your granddaughter (if and when she should reach puberty) to be subjected to this.
The site should be called "Everyday sexual harassment and worse"

everydaysexism.com

Apparently "builders live in fear of being accused of sexual harassment if they wolf whistle"? How awful for them - but hadn't it crossed their minds that there's a way of avoiding all this anxiety - stop wolf whistling!

Iam64's recollections regarding the routine encounters that her daughters experienced - ".... the amount of horn pipping, chaps hanging out of windows making the universal sign for masturbation. The girls reassured him [their dad] that they had got used to it, and to ignore it" - surely suggests that a lot of this sort of male behaviour has very little to do with complimenting a woman and a lot to do with the inflated sense of their own importance that some men have - a presumption that a woman should care what their opinion is of her.

I, and I'm sure some other women, have always disliked this type of male behaviour - long before the, in my opinion, rather silly phrase "political correctness" was ever thought of. This is about more women now saying that they are unwilling to continue to collude in their own sexual objectification.

I would also say that this is not a men v. women issue. Increasing numbers of men, particularly in the US, have supported a campaign against this sort of street harassment.

Actually absent I'd also apply that description to those who have also criticised the young woman

I am amazed that this sort of thing is still happening in 2015. The men involved – and, as I understand it, it was more than one man ogling a solitary woman – are really unreconstructed Neanderthals.

So why is it the 'sisterhood's ( whatever that is) job to complain about sexist adverts where men are the subjects? Where are the 'brotherhood' supporting the young woman in this case? FWIW, many of us who criticise sexism directed at women would also criticise it the other way round. But even having said that, the coke advert was not REAL - what happened to this woman was. And I don't understand the point about Italy - why on earth does it matter what is normal there? Have you seen what is normal in Saudi Arabia for example?

VQ....the exact point re the Coke advert has just been made on R4 along with a comment as to how silent the sisterhood were about it.

Try going to Italy! - I took my 3 girls when they were teenage/early twenties and the Italian men were very vocal in their appreciation of this bevy of beauty (not me!). It is quite normal over there.

I don't know if it was sexual harassment or not. Whistling happened all the time when I was young and I didn't feel threatened but then I didn't grow up in PC world where every comment and action has to be watched.

I'm not saying that PC is a bad thing and I'd hate to go back to the openly racist, homophobic days but ....and I'm ducking as I type this.....have we gone a little too far?

If she was intimidated when the man stepped in front of her then fair enough but a whistle is only a whistle and it's a sign of approval. It's not as if they were verbally abusing her. We can be sexual objects just as men can be sexual objects. If you think women don't leer at men just think about the Diet Coke advert.

She should have tried whistling back. A bit of humour often dispels what could be a threatening situation. Having read most of the above, though, I expect she was right to go to the cops. Let's hope there is no backlash.

4 pages of wonderful pro the complainer responses on this same news item on MN.

I think Eleothan has hit the nail on the head.

Wolf whistling is not really a friendly way of letting a woman know she is attractive. It is a male bonding exercise, blokes showing off to their mates.

How often does a single male wolf whistle a woman he does not know?
Hardly ever. They always hunt in packs (yes, a bit dramatic but the analogy appealed to me).

I think most people on here were saying that a wolf whistle probably wouldn't constitute a sex crime, but I think most are agreed that jumping in front of someone, invading their personal space and being overtly familiar would constitute harrassment and would make any woman or girl feel uneasy.
How did the papers get hold of it though?

Times change don't they?I think that women today won't put up with the things that our generation used to.Our daughters probably put up with more than our grand-daughters will.I remember builders whistling, shouting and smiling at me from about the age of 12 which is ridiculously young, and I really hated it.I once met my daughter after school when she was 15, and two different lorry drivers hung out of their windows and tooted at her, and to my surprise she seemed to enjoy the attention!however that is different to having to walk past a building site.you would need to be very confident not to mind constant whistling and yelling.One good thing about being older I suppose, it doesn't happen any more.

Good post Flick- how can anyone read that and then say what happened to the young woman was acceptable? I really can't believe some of the posts on here.

Crun.....didn't mean to belittle any issues you had/have, I took your post in a different way than you intended, I'm sorry for that. This is where print lets us down, sometimes we need to hear the tone of voice as well. I hope you reached a satisfactory conclusion with your complaint.

Sexual harassment in the workplace can - and dors - cut both ways. My husband speaks of having to run the gauntlet of women working in the production line in an engineering factory in the early 70's. As a young engineer he wouid be sent down from the design office to sort out a problem and would be pinched and groped as he made his way down the line. What was done to young apprentices by the women would nowadays constitute an attack, not harassment.

Over lunch I looked at the headline on the front page of the DM and said to DH 'That headline is grossly misleading, when you read what actually happened' He said that had been his re-action as well.

The full story is very different. To quote 'When she was wolf whistled at by builders on her walk to work she first tried to ignore it. But as the wolf whistles and accompanying sexist comments turned into a daily ritual she began to get upset. Finally after a MONTH (my caps) of unwanted attention she had had enough - and called the police.

One of the workers even approached her on the pavement, blocking her way before saying 'Morning love'. He was probably 18 or 19 and got right in my face, standing next to an older man. He didn't touch me but they were in my personal space on the pavement, even though I blanked him out

The story above is my definition of persistent sexual harassment and she was absolutely right to go to the police. I think the men concerned should be shamed by being named, even if there is a decision not to prosecute.

I just took it that it was one of her typical days.