Am I the only one who...

If it was a 'killer' heart attack I might agree with you but it sounds as if this lady made a good recovery thanks to this this man's intervention......
When J collapsed, I knew he was dead but was encouraged to perform CPR by the emergency services until the paramedics arrived. It is something you do because you want that person to be alive, not dead. If I was ill and ancient and not wanting to continue life, then no, I don't want to be revived thank you very much!

Circumstances alter cases and I have to say in 30 years of nursing most of that with older people and in end of life care I have learnt that life is sweet and people cling on hard. I have only ever met a few who said 'let me go now' and even fewer relatives who wanted active medical care withdrawn.

I have let my in laws know that I don't want to be kept alive if I have no expectation of quality of life. This will differ from person to person, in my case I wouldn't want to have to rely on someone else for my basic needs - going to the toilet etc.

I think it's hard to say.... until it happens to you. Then it may be too late of course.

Bit of a challenge this one thatbags. I read recently that a number of doctors have do not resuscitate on their notes, because they are more aware of the realities than perhaps most of us are.

suebailey1, can you clarify what you mean by active medical care? If I was 90, blind, deaf, unable to walk, toilet, feed myself or respond in anyway, I hope my loved ones would feel able to ask for iv fluids to be stopped, and for anything that could help ease my passing to be offered.

I recognise this isn't what everyone would want, and that for religious reasons, some of us will be opposed to any form of intervention that does not prolong life. For others amongst us, it could be the last loving thing we could offer our loved one.

I hope I haven't hurt or offended anyone with these comments. This is a difficult subject, and I wish we could get better at talking about it.

very difficult one this...as OP says..each case is so different, my OH has numerous health probs getting worse as each month goes by, he has been resuscitated 3 times and has had several other heart attacks, the last one being approx. 5 yrs ago, they brought him back but his legs and other things have deteriated, he is going blind now, and if the worst comes to the worst, then if he has another heart attack I am sure that if he makes it back round again, he will be even more incapacitated, but then!! when and if it does happen! I think human nature would take over and you or whoever could not just sit there and watch some one die without trying to help them first..I don't know...I have never been in that situation.

Bags I wish someone had resuscitated my Dad when he suffered a killer heart attack at the age of 55.
As time goes on, I feel the sense of loss more keenly, as I realise just how much we as a family, and he has missed. He never saw his grandchildren, although he knew he first one was on the way. He would have loved them, and they him.
Perhaps your children feel the same way about you.

For me, it would depend on my physical and mental health. My ex mother in law died recently following a long deterioration. My daughter was very fond of her Nana and it broke her heart to see her unable to see or move. DD said she never wanted to go through that again and to be honest I wouldn't want her too. If I am able I will certainly have a DNR if the time is right for me.

I have head several discussions with my children about being kept alive when quality has gone. I just hope they will all be of the same mind when the time comes.

It would be good to think that choices could be made but in the circumstances of sudden heart attack who knows what the outcome would be.

How would they know in advance that it was definitely a killer heart attack? I would prefer to be on the safe side. ie, please feel free to thump.



(Another cheerful thread )

Good man I say.

I agree Jingl
In Bags' link, the woman was on her way to Benidorm on holiday, hardly decrepit and possibly even in her prime.

It was heart-warming to hear such a lovely story, wasn't it, and great that the outcome was, I think, so happy. Two nice people here, one acting to save a life, the other taking the trouble to 'twitter' a thanks, in the hope that it will be seen by the person it was meant for.

I don't like the phrase 'a killer heart attack'. Surely it isn't a killer unless it has actually killed. Sorry - unreconstructed pedant!

Agreeing with Printmiss on this a person in the right place at the right time ,it was surely not this ladies time to go I do hope the man involved finds out that his actions saved this ladies life and gets the handshake he deserves.

DNR is a grey area. All depends on personal choice and whether someone feels they will benefit from resuscitation or decide they have had enough and just want to die. ie. someone who has recurring heart attacks may feel enough is enough as opposed to,someone suffering their first heart attack and would want to be resuscitated.

Not a decision to be made when you are hale and hearty as you will,have no idea how you will really feel until you are in that situation.

Personally, I would have DNR on my notes or, inform my family with the instruction that if I were hospitalised due to a condition that left me unable to be independent or in a vegatitive state then I would not want to be resuscitated.

I meant a heart attack that would kill if no-one intervened, anno, or if no-one administered CPR. Sorry, I though it was obvious that that is what I meant. Sometimes I forget that nothing is obvious.

I'm not sure, but I think there's a difference between a heart attack and a cardiac arrest and if CPR is appropriate then it is a cardiac arrest. Ahoy, jeni!

Interesting idea, jings, that indoctrination stuff. I don't remember much about indoctrination, though there may have been some. More importantly, both my parents were very good teachers of various things but pretty useless indoctrinators. That's a nice thought to go to bed with. G'night all

You on the wrong thread Bags?

Night night.

I'm almost 70 in constant pain. I'm definitely DNR. I've had a good life on the whole and lived to know the joy of grandchildren who I love dearly.
But frankly my dear, I couldn't give a damm ( for the rest)
DNR

I wouldn't want to have my ribs broken when I was already very old, frail and my body (and spirit) was giving up!

Happens quite often apparently during CPR.

A heart attack comes on slowly and doesn't immediately stop the heart from functioning. A cardiac arrest comes on suddenly.

I agree with suebailey.

As I said on a recent thread, when people are hail and hearty and death is a long way off, they're very gung-ho and say they don't want intervention ..... but I see it time and again, when push comes to shove the will to live is very strong.

It's rather like those who say they'll refuse life-saving drugs/procedures if they've been tested on animals - the late Linda McCartney comes to mind - but in the end they acquiesce because they want to live.

Bags I am genuinely puzzled.
'A heart attack that would kill if no-one intervened'
Do you hold the same view about other conditions?
If you had pneumonia, would you wish for no treatment?
What about cancer? If you had a cancer that if left untreated would kill you, but which if treated could be eradicated, would you decline treatment?
I don't understand your references to indoctrination either.

My aunt saved my uncle when he had a heart attack, but later said she regretted it when he developed terminal bladder cancer. But would he really have wanted to miss the happy years he had with his family before he developed the cancer?