Self-deprecation

I always thought it meant that he did not actually order them to be in that positions, but ordered arranged the template so that there those differentials existed - he presumably allowed individuals to move from one category to another.

Punctuation matters too, whether you read "He made them, high or lowly," ie, made everyone, whatever their social class, or "He made them high or lowly," ie, caused them to be high or lowly.

Eats shoots and leaves!

They miss that verse out now!

I have a real visual image of that "Poor man at his Gate" as well Elegran
I wonder if it was ever in an illustrated book I may have seen.

I cannot stand that hymn now largely because of the social attitudes implied in that original third verse.
"God made them high and lowly.
And ordered their estate."

I have always pictures the poor man in his little cottage just outside the gate to the castle. A handy position when the lady of the manor was out distributing largesse.

Aha! I may not have been deluded all these years then!

How about the ballad about the gypsies singing at the castle gate? That castle had a gate.

And one of the gypsies pulled the posh bird.

You've had it wrong all these years Ana?!

Portcullis?
Portcullises?
Portcullii??
Any port in a storm?

No, castles don't have gates, do they?

Isn't the poor man supposed to be at the rich man's gate? I may be wrong, but that's the way I've always read it...

and the goverment is ordering lots of estates.

At least the poor man had a gate.

Picking up on your post of Monday morning Soutra - what a sad comment. I think this "know your place" conditioning of children was common in the 19th and 20th century amongst the "lower classes" while the upper layers were, if they were male, trained to believe they were born to rule. There's the verse in All things Bright and Beautiful, isn't there

The rich man in his castle
The poor man at his gate
They made them high and lowly
And ordered their estate

Oh well done! I am struggling with the last clues on Saturday's Guardian Cryptic..based on Under Milkwood.

I became head of a primary school where kids got stickers for anything! I stopped it quickly but it was hard work changing the minds of some staff. Kids are not silly and they know a readily awarded 'sticker' is a 'sop'. I think if praise/reward is given too freely it becomes worthless and has the reverse effect. Eventually we only gave awards for extra effort and for good deeds. We expected kids to behave, work well and learn. That was the baseline so no reward for that! But persevering in a difficult task, spontaneous acts of kindness etc were rewarded. Obviously we said positive things when kids did good work but we did not go overboard as there was always the next thing to learn! Standards, of behaviour and work, began to rise...but it took time!

Just finished today's DT cryptic crossword!

Agreed Mishap!
Galen, so pleased to read you're feeling less fed up today.

Hope today is looking brighter for you galen. Don't let the b*****s grind you down. We do not have to be productive, we just have to be ourselves. When did this idea enter the public consciousness that those of us who are retired have no value? - many cultures look up to their elders. Just because our culture seems to have gone astray in that regard does not mean we should sell ourselves short or devalue our lives. Being restricted in mobility gives us a chance to develop other aspects of our personalities - I write poetry and enjoy our local book club too. I think, therefore I am; not I produce therefore I am! Onwards and upwards! We must stick together!

of course self deprecation only really works when the person really has something they could crow about but doesn't.
Too much [ as just about everyone has said] isn't good, balance etc.
There's an episode of Blackadder Goes Forth [in the trenches] where George has to paint a picture and it's amazingly good,and Blackadder says ' George! Why didn't you tell us that you could paint?' George says ' Well, one doesn't want to blow ones own trumpet y'know' and Blackadder replies 'you could at least have told us you HAD a trumpet!'
Mishap your DGS is charming bounding in and saying 'I'm here!' at 2.5 years old, but wouldn't be half as charming at 25.

23% for o level Latin. Hit the target at archery occasionally!
I'm quite good at simple crochet
But thanks

Galen you are good at archery and Latin, that's two things straightaway.

Dogs are great company.

I have a very realistic looking house brick made of foam.It is fantastic for throwing at walls(or annoying people) when frustration or bloody-mindedness takes over.I will send you all a virtual one to do with as you wish.

I love dogs. Would like to have one.

My bloody dog just tried to escape - I'll send her your way Galen, use her for target practice. Glad you're a bit cheerier today. X

Thank you. I always wanted one like that.