Relationship with in laws (I’m the DIL)

The problem I see is that this dynamic of benign disinterest has gone on for at least 12 years, from what the OP has said. Shifting it now is going to take a fair bit of effort from everyone. Pumpkin can't do it on her own, and her DH seems to have an attitude of, "Huh, we should do something..." but doesn't appear to make any phone calls or plans. Nor do his parents. It's exhausting, trying to change a long term dynamic when you're the only one working at it.

The zoo situation as it happened, wasn't what was best for her son. Being cooped up in the cafe, rather than going to see the animals? Talk about an exercise in frustration! I can't imagine trying to keep a toddler occupied in a cafe when there was a whole zoo waiting.

I agree that what happened when they went to the zoo wasn't the best for Pumpkin's son but there's no suggestion that staying in the cafe was at the behest of her in laws.

She could have stayed for an hour in the cafe and then gone round the zoo without them. They may not have been happy had she done so, but we need to take responsibility for the decision we make, even those that with hind sight perhaps weren't the right ones.

Keeping 'the door open' doesn't mean "trying to change a long term dynamic", it's providing the opportunity for the relationship to improve.

The zoo thing is horrible. I'd have been too polite to abandon them at the cafe. PIL should have exersized some common sense and either rearranged or said "go without us". They put their children in an awkward situation. Who wants to abandon an obviously injured person and look like they don't care?

This was a no win situation and judging by past experiences they would have complained if left in the cafe.

"common sense" is just as applicable to the OP as it was to her p's.i.l. in this particular situation.

Her f.i.l. wouldn't have been "abandoned" FGS his wife was with him. I'm sure they would have complained but the ultimate decision was taken by the mother.

Some of us are naturally more assertive and confident than others however, it's the ultimate responsibility of the parent to do right by their child as we are constantly reminded of here on GN.

Lol no I don't agree at all.

On the one hand Pumpkin is being told to work hard for a positive relationship and on the other, she should have just abandoned them in the cafe when she was actually trying to do exactly what people advise and spend time with them and work towards a positive relationship.

Total contradiction.

They are clearly at fault in that situation. They need to meet her half way and if they aren't going to, we'll Pumpkin has proven how hard she is trying so they shouldn't complain when she gives up.

The zoo thing confused me. It made no sense at all for them all to sit in a café all day, that’s just silly and is taking the “be nice to the in-laws” thing way too far.

This post could have been written by my BF. Her in-laws never seemed interested and her DH made very little contact with his parents. She was always the one phoning them and sending updates about the children It’s only now, some 27 years later, that her MiL has told her how grateful she was that she did this. The MiL appeared to be a right dragon but she was in fact her DH and DCs doormat.
Don’t be a doormat but don’t close your heart to your in-laws either. It may not be the close relationship that you wish to have but they are your child’s GPs.

We used to park my mum up and nip off to do bits and bobs when we were out.
A bit pointless going shopping then all sitting on a bench before going home again.

It didn't make any sense to me either Lucca.

She wouldn't have "abandoned" them, why the need for melodramatic rhetoric? An hour or two at the most in the cafe then going round the zoo is common sense IMO.

The OP would have met them half way and if they'd complained about it it wouldn't have been the end of the world would it. I haven't seen anyone tell Pumpkin she should "work hard for a positive relationship*.

She's being encouraged by some to work at the relationship within reason which is good advice and preferable to being encouraged to not bother at all.

"They are clearly at fault in this situation" well for some posters the p's.i.l./GP's usually are aren't they.

"Don't be a doormat but don't close your heart to your in-laws either" is good advice nandad.

You parking your mum up did make me smile MissA

Semantics

pumpkin didn't do anything wrong at the zoo. Learnt a lesson about her in laws and will probably avoid that scenario in future and its their own fault.

No not semantics, personal opinion.

If you as a parent decide to spend hours sitting in the cafe at the zoo rather than spending at least some of the time taking your child around the zoo then IMO, that's the wrong decision on the part of the parent.

'Your child, your rules' so often repeated here on GN should apply in all situations, not just the ones that suit people depending on their personal agenda.

Smileless you were arguing the difference between what I said and what has been said which is very small and using my own words doesn't negate my point.

Your second paragraph. I have no idea how that is relevant honestly, things are never black and white. Especially in relationships when it matters to at least the one party we are able to speak to, to try to make it better.

I don't agree with you VS it's as simple as that.

I know but we could have just given our separate opinions and moved on.

I'm always happy to do that but not very good at letting being told I am wrong go unchallenged.

What matters is what works for OP

My MIL tried the complaining about her other daughter in law behaviour to me, I made it pretty clear that I wasn't interested in criticising her, and in fact, I agreed with her, so why would I criticise her for things I agreed with her about. Even if you agree it would be better not to engage about him
RE the zoo, another time keep a fun day for your son to people who will appreciate it, ie your little family. He could have borrowed a wheelchair and got out and about a bit, and retreated to the cafe when he felt like it. Zoo trips are so expensive so another reason not to waste the money on someone who doesn't appreciate the venue. If you do similar another time find a free venue maybe a park with a cafe and go off to the playground or to see the ducks and if they want to come with you so be it. Or maybe a children's farm. My inlaws were pretty selfish, didn't like going to somewhere like a zoo or a playground where there wasn't much of interest to them, once the FIL asked where we wanted to go and showed us some info, and I said I'd love to go to x place but he started sulking and we ended up going to his favourite place, as they were both retired they could have gone any day. I discovered later when the children were older, that there was a very famous children's attraction [this was pre internet] and lots of people said how great it was but they never even suggested it.
RE pressie for BIL, you just needed to get home, what sort of a quality visit would it have been if all you'd done there was walk him around, another time maybe post the pressie. Presumably this was in covid times and your baby could have been ill. Would they have wanted to risk catching something from him? What do you think she would say if you apologised again said you'd not been planning to stop but needed to get home as going to BIL was just too far, you are grateful that they gave the gift to BIL but in future, if need be you'll just post it, to avoid upset, You have a lot on your plate with a small child, they should be fitting in with you much of the time, working around your availability as much as possible, obviously, there will be times when you have to compromise.

Pumpkin said One of the things I have seen on GN that resonates is posters advising others to develop good relationships with their children/partners as this relationship will significantly impact the one they have with their GC. In that sense, I feel like my in laws aren’t remotely interested in me, and it doesn’t make me feel like I want to go out of my way to offer up the little time we have as a family, to spend with them

Why not give your husband your input, allow him to deal with his parents as decided upon. Quite a normal approach.

I agree with Hithere really (I pressed the button on my response before editing it so sorry ! ) so the short answer is leave it to DH and yes ‘drop the rope’.

My brother-in-law and his wife have taken my mother-in-law on a couple of cruises. Mother-in-law is partially sighted and not very mobile. If there was an excursion they fancied, eg a trip to a waterfall one time, they would "park" mother-in-law in a chair on the deck, near a toilet, and ask one of the stewards to keep an eye on her and fetch her some drinks and lunch from the buffet. She was quite happy with this arrangement and they all enjoyed their day.

I cant really understand Pumpkin why you felt unable to take your child around the zoo? You could have had a drink/cake/meal whatever together, giving your child and his grandparents a chance to chat etc....which would be nice for both of them (I assume that the GPs were engaging with him?).

Then you could have said that you were going to take your son round the zoo and would be back in 1 1/2 hours. Ask if they would like another tea whilst they wait or would they prefer to go and sit elsewhere whilst they waited!

To be honest it surprises me too that your PIL didn't say to youto take him off to look round the zoo ...I think many GPs would not expect a young child to put up with sitting in a cafe for hours!

I do think it is was unwise to prioritise "spending time with your PIL" over the needs of your young son who clearly and unsurprisingly would not be thrilled at sitting in a cafe for ages! It would hardly be conducive to positive engagement with his GPs anyway really. I don't mean that comment unkindly, I just think it is worth thinking about whether you actually realised that is what you were doing and then thinking about why! Ask yourself, in that circumstance, what was more important - your PIL being with a miserable grandson/spending time with your PIL OR your son having a bit of time in the cafe with them and then fun going round the zoo?

Ask yourself if worrying about building a relationship with PIL and between them and your son is taking over everything else that should be considered in particular circumstances.

Going forward I suggest you think carefully about what it is you are trying to create between your son/his GPs and yourself/PIL. Maybe think in terms of briefer outings or ones with less walking if PIL have any mobility issues etc. A short trip to a park with a cafe and playground? A trip to feed the ducks? That type of thing maybe?

Hope you can work out a way forward for you all.

PS if they complained about being left in the cafe then you could have said "I am sorry but as we didnt know about the crutches, there doesn't seem to be an alternative. (Son) is too young to sit here for too long, so this is the only option. When we come back he can tell you about the animals he has seen etc " Then go!

Perhaps there might have been a little shop ...to buy a small something for grandson to show them when he got back to the cafe ...his favourite animal model or something ...so that they can all chat about it? Overall finding sources to create engagement might help him and them in developing a relationship.

Madgran77 Given I understand your zoo ideas, why is DH not to be accommodating the interactions?

True Norah! As Pumpkin is asking about the problem from her perspective I was "speaking" to her. Unless I missed it, I'm not sure if DH was present on the zoo visit or not. My suggestions could be facilitated by either parent or both parents together. Whatever works for them, but most importantly what works for son/grandson really.

Regarding the trip to the zoo, we started with coffee in the cafe, then PIL insisted they would come round with us but FIL was struggling and kept stopping to sit down for a break. DS then fell asleep for his nap and by the time he woke up it was chucking it down. I didn’t really fancy walking around by myself in the rain (DH would have stayed with PIL in the cafe). I was annoyed at myself for not being more assertive at the start of the day but I was taken aback that FIL was on crutches to be honest, he had been on them since before we suggested the zoo, I was a bit cheesed off that they hadn’t told us because we wouldn’t have suggested the zoo if we had known.

PIL don’t really interact with DS. FIL finds him easier than MIL, DH says she doesn’t really ‘do’ small children which is why she gets so stressed about providing childcare for BIL. That’s partly why I don’t enjoy sitting down for coffee, because I sit there entertaining DS on the floor and they watch from the sofa. Feels awkward and I can’t be part of the conversation really because DS constantly wants interaction at this age. They sit and talk to DH, I guess this is another example of feeling like they don’t care much for me, they don’t try and bring me into the conversation, just leave me dealing with DS.

I don’t think I’ve been unfair in ceasing to organise things and message as I did before. I was coming round to the school of thought that they are DH’s responsibility to sort out, and my side of the family are mine. I also realised I wasn’t enjoying seeing them or getting anything out of it, and now I have so little time and different priorities than before I had DS.

I don’t know if I really ‘want’ anything from them either. I think perhaps I am worried I am doing something wrong or that I should be doing more, but I also feel like I’m at a point in my life where I don’t want to do so many things that I don’t enjoy. Life is so short. I’ve never been good at putting me first, and I guess I worry I am being selfish by leaving it to DH. Having seen what they’re like over the last year, I can’t see them having a great relationship with DS. But is that up to me? I guess what this thread is helping me to realise, is that I probably can’t manufacture that by myself anyway, and even if I could to a degree, is it the right thing to do? I am not sure it is. I don’t think it would feel genuine.

I’ve had a read of the thread about things you wish you knew, and that is encouraging me to think the way I’ve explained above too..! Rightly or wrongly

Pumpkin I think you've tried very hard and you shouldn't be judged for taking a step back now. This time with your babies is precious. Let them organise themselves and just enjoy your time with your children

Well it's up to you Pumpkin. You can make an effort with your in law's for the sake of your son and husband or not. A couple of us have said here that we didn't get on particularly well with our in law's but made an effort for our children's and husband's sake.

You can simply encourage your husband to be more proactive in his relationship with his parents but of course that will be up to him, and then step back.

They may wish to be more involved when he's older as your H has said your m.i.l. "doesn't really do small children" but only time will tell.

Talk to your H, tell him how you feel and that if it's your decision to step back, that's what you're going to do and it will his responsibility to arrange times for his parents to see their GS.