Not how I raised mine

Maybe your son would like you yo be more involved with his kids while respecting their schedule?

Sorry I'm writing so much, but there's a lot to take in here...

" My son asked me to help with childcare when my eldest granddaughter started school, so I booked the days and half days off work - then when it came to the day she didn’t want to come because it was boring. She found the journey to my house from her nursery boring (about 40 minutes) so she stopped coming over night too..."

Talk about "the best laid plans, etc," LOL! But you tried. I hope ODS appreciated the time you took off from work to do him and ODIL this favor. Some parents would have said, in effect, "Too bad if you find the journey boring, you're going to GM's house till we can pick you up." Others would have used their imagination to find ways to make the trip more fun. But ODS and ODIL chose to accept OGD's feelings as they were, and that's their right. I'm sorry if it inconvenienced you and hope you were able to rearrange your schedule or use the time to do things for yourself. The good news is that, clearly, ODS and ODIL were able to find other childcare arrangements. They don't need to depend on you (yay!).

"The first time he stopped talking was after they married and I told my DiLs sister how beautiful she looked - the DiL overheard and caused a bit of a stink, which appears to be her way .."

Why did DIL mind your complimenting her sister? Did she just think the day should be all about her, period? Or did you not compliment her, as well? I don't get this... Regardless, if ODS stopped speaking to you b/c he felt ODIL was hurt, it shows he's protective of his family's feelings - ODIL's, your GDs', etc. IMO, if you do reconcile, it's important to be aware of that.

"Where does it say son has reconnected?? I can’t see this? "

SB74, he messaged her a compliment on the GC's present. I think that's what NotSpaghetti meant by "reconnected."

Grandmablue, my heart goes out to you! First, I am deeply sorry about DH's (dear husband's) face cancer and loss of an eye. What a heartbreaking experience! I hope he's doing ok now. Also, I'm sorry that you have been poorly, as well. And, of course, I'm sorry that ODS (older dear son) is keeping his kids away from you.

I imagine DH's experience w/ cancer makes him even less patient w/ backtalk, etc. While I agree that you and he need to accept the way that ODS and ODIL raise their kids, if he feels disrespected by OGD (oldest granddaughter), IMO, he has a right to speak up. IDk what he argues w/ her about, overall. If he's trying to tell her she can't do things her parents allow, then he's out of line. But, IMO, he has a right to say "Don't talk back to me," even if the parents permit backtalk. He has a right to establish how he is to be treated. And he certainly has a right to object - and so do you - if she kicks you!

Other than that, I agree with PPs (previous posters) that it is up to the parents how they raise their kids. I take it you and DH don't like that fact that they are raising their children "via a book," one that promotes some different childrearing methods than you two are used to. IMO, you have a right to your opinion about this, but you need to keep it to yourself and not give any indication that you disapprove (if that has been a problem). Strict schedules, for example, may work best for their family, even if you and DH don't agree or if, unfortunately, their schedules don't coincide w/ yours. ODS' siblings have no business trying to assert their childrearing beliefs w/ him and ODIL either, and I'm glad you've asked them to avoid falling out w/ them.

No doubt, your story is confusing, but I take it that another problem is that ODS feels you prioritize other things over his kids? IMO, he is being unrealistic and oversensitive. He has no right to expect you to travel to see gymnastics class every week or at all. It's nice, though, that he wants you to be involved in their lives (some GPs would give their eye teeth for this!), and "sometimes" may seem too vague to him. I know you didn't ask for advice, but can't help but wonder... Could you compromise and go, say, once a month or once every other month? At least, then he would know you're committed to being there for them.

If, for whatever reason, he suspects you're not truly interested in his kids, he may have misinterpreted the missed 5:30 contact as proof of that. Did you explain to him that a meeting ran over time? What was his response to that?

As for the gifts, I don't see any harm in your sending them, unless you've been asked not to. Rock and hard place. The fact that you weren't invited to the party could have been a signal not to send gifts either, but not doing so could also have been interpreted, once again as "not interested" and "bad granny." I'm glad you sent them and that you got a positive reaction.

I don't think it's "rude" either to send a gift for the birthday child's sibling, as well. In my family, we always do that though it's usually a smaller, less expensive gift than for the bday child. We do it so the other child doesn't feel left out. the bday child is generally too excited w/ their own gifts to mind their sibling getting one small thing. Nothing wrong w/ it, IMO, and actually very generous of you.

Then again, I don't think it was rude for ODS to ignore the group message or remove himself from the conversation. I often see people do that in group chats if they're on the outs w/ some of the people in the group or aren't interested in what's being discussed. If ODS wasn't speaking to you at the time (you didn't say), then it doesn't surprise me that he left the conversation. In fact, I would have expected it.

I may be wrong, but I think his text about the gifts is partly his way of showing you that he responds when he feels you have given thought to his kids. I hope this opens up the lines of communication, but I know you're "not sure" if you "want to med bridges," so IDK how that will work out. If you do want to try again, I would let ODS know that if you miss one of those FTs, it's b/c of work, not b/c you've "forgotten" about them and to let you know if you can call later in those circumstances.

"I’ve put so much into my grandson because I know my daughter would never stop me seeing him."

Has ODS complained about the time/effort you give to GS? Does he think you're favoring him? I understand "self-preservation," but please make sure you treat all your grands as equally as the parents will allow. ODS needs to understand, though, that if he keeps his kids away from you or is rigid about when you can see them or not, that you are likely to become more involved w/ GS. That's just reality.

As PPs have said, however, I don't think it's a good idea to invest too much of yourself (general you) in any one C or GC. Fortunately, you also have DH and your work. I hope you also enjoy time w/ friends, DH, and maybe even just by yourself, reading a good book, maybe, or watching favorite television shows.

Whether you resume communication w/ ODS or not, I wish you and DH the best. Hugs!

Hoping you can reconnect ...and I'm assuming he is your first born...why is it that there’s often such strong dynamics with our eldest child. I have such stress with communication with my eldest son. Perhaps there’s so much emotional investment when the first child is growing up..I don’t know. Maybe take a step back. Go gently..,with yourself...and your family....no advice but hope it sorts itself out.

GoodMama, I think you have made a number very thoughtful and relevant observations although, unfortunately, I suspect they may not be so well regarded by the OP. I hope I am wrong but these would be hard truths to face for anyone.

Tuesday bath night...*once a week* ? ??

GoodMama, I am not Grandmablue, however if I were terribly sad and worried about a relationship I'd rather be given positive advice like you gave. I'd pay you as a counsellor!

Dont have contact with my two GC. DS & DIL have decided it is best. Other GP have little contact. DS says its just the way things are these days. It is how they want to raise their children. After a lot of counselling i now accept this and get on with my life. I send birthday and Xmas presents and am writing about myself , my childhood, my life now and how i feel about things for them to have when i die, hopefully a way off yet. Live your life accept your life. Its not easy and when you get a contact you will be thrilled

GoodMama
Exactly.
I couldn't have put it better myself.

Of course our AC are entitled to raise their children as they wish. Undoubtedly things have changed since we raised our own children but that said, good manners should IMO always be instilled into the next generation.

I can understand your DH wanting 'please and thank you's' to be a part of his interaction with his GC Grandmablue but arguing with a 6 year old is perhaps not ideal.

It would IMO be unreasonable for your son and d.i.l. to reduce contact because you have different attitudes toward good manners. If your GD had gone home and as suggested by another poster said 'GD was mean to me', common sense would dictate that they ask her what had happened and then discussed the matter with you and your H.

Often in this situation one is faced with the 'your damned if you do and damned if you don't' scenario. I see nothing at all wrong in sending your GC a birthday gift even though you hadn't been invited to the party, and don't understand why you were criticized by another poster for doing so.

The issue appears to be your not being available as and when your son and d.i.l. want you to be. To ask if you've forgotten your GC because you weren't available to face time at the specified time, speaks volumes. It is also rather ironic when they withdraw your GC all together if they don't get their own way.

I'm glad you've had a text from your S thanking you for the gifts and hopefully this may lead to further communication in the future.

You may like to take a look at the 'Support for those living with estrangement' thread on the Estrangement forum where you'll see posts from other p's and gp's facing the same difficulties as yourself. .

Thoughtfully put

GoodMamma I read through yoyr reply and although sounding a bit harsh actually made very good sense.
To have one child out of 4 who obviously has been the favourite is unforgivable. He has probably told his mother in the past to "back off" and as you say why on earth would you send gifts to the other children when it's only one child's birthday - that's just bonkers.
Hopefully she will read your post and take note but tbh I doubt it

I should have said “some parents” to be fair!

One thing that strikes me is that there are conflicts over seemingly minor things but there are obviously deeper issues. A frank but calm discussion about what it is that is really upsetting them with a period of time of quiet reflection might sort things.
The thing that stands out most is the difference of parenting styles between you and them. Well, whether you believe in modern ways or not should not be up for discussion. Their kids, their ways. Who knows, they may end up bringing up adults who are considerate and will not go “no contact” when things go wrong. Maybe our ways weren’t so brilliant when you look at parents of today.

I don’t find this post confusing. Its complex and emotional because that is what families are. Grandmablue May not be able to actually articulate one reason this has happened as she may not actually know the real reason.
I have 2 daughters I became a grandmother at a younger age than most, I now have 7 AGED 1-18. One daughter has 5 and one daughter has 2. Over the years I have been banned from seeing my grandkids from both girls a number of times. (the one with 5 kids has done more than the other)
I am in an ok place right now seeing all of them but I am very aware I may say or do something that they feel justifies their actions and I could lose them again.
In my case this is normally always down to money. I work full time but am a widow so I do struggle with things like buying them cars and stuff and this has caused problems.

I used to get upset, feel like I was grieving to the point I even had a breakdown over it.

A few years back I found out that my daughter who had turned on me, was having an affair and I realised that she had removed me from her life as she knew these were not the values she had been brought up with and didn’t want to hear my disapproval (she wouldn’t have as I keep my mouth shut) Then about a year later she invited me over like nothing had happened and her new partner was there!!! From this point I realised as long as I was being the best person I could be, then the problem laid with her not me.

I too send gifts to them all and let them know they are all loved missed and welcome in my life if their parents are offended by this then they can choose to hold them back.

I have just learned to step back and wait and every time my daughters have come back to me because they need me more than I need them. ( I give so much support and child care but they give very little back) Yes it hurts and Yes I miss them but I am not in control.
As some of my GK have become older they have contacted me and I seen them and spent days with them.

I wish you well and hope this works out for you.

Where does it say son has reconnected?? I can’t see this?

Op, I’m afraid that when young children are involved you need to respect what the parents want, as long as not abusive of course, and that includes routines and times when it is good for you to talk to them and their routines. My mum doesn’t make any effort with my kids, she posts magazines and presents but they don’t mean much because she can’t be bothered to actually see them. I don’t cut her out but we only see her when my sisters arrange something as a family. You should make more effort with your GC and accept your son and did raise them differently.

Good mama hit the nail on the head with this post as she could only respond to the information shared. She was not being nasty and I’m surprised that some people have chosen to interpret honesty for negative judgement. This is obviously a complicated family dynamic and I do understand how upsetting this must be for everybody in the family and wonder if Grandmablue could arrange to meet with her son and DIL to have a open and honest conversation that leads to a line being drawn under the past with a fresh start for everyone. It takes courage to be the bigger person and shoulder blame when it feels like people are not taking responsibility for their own actions but the reward of re-establishing a successful and happy relationship may be worth it.

I'm afraid GoodMama read your initial post as I did. I read into it as she did. Clearly there is more to it than either of us saw and now some of the misunderstandings have subsequently been explained. We all feel for you, and wish you the best. GoodMama actually also says she wishes you well.

It's certainly good news that your son has reconnected, so fingers crossed you can all start again now. All estrangements, however temporary, are painful. I hope this up-and-down situation settles into something more mutually acceptable soon.
Good luck!

Can I ask why you don’t just TALK to your son, or rather listen to him? A phone call saying you’d really like to fix the lack of contact, then meet him and ask what his reasons are. Of course, you’d then have to accept what he says, and do what he and his wife want, as it looks like your previous ‘ heart to hearts’ weren’t very successful.

Life is full of pitfalls! Goodmama's advice is frank but true. If you want things to change you have to change. It's just a choice we make.

Grandmablue pay no attention to the likes of GoodMama who thinks she knows it all from one post of yours and glorifies in her own goodness!

You may well have the solution you hinted at already. Let this son go. You have other children more appreciative of your worth and limitations. Sorry to read of your DH’s face cancer. That’s a truly horrible thing to happen.

I wish you joy of your daughter’s child and future children and any others you might have from your other two sons.

Thank you :-)

Look the door is open he’s thanked you I d take great hope in that Keep your opinions tight within your heart and hopefully he will come round but maybe he’s not a person ( or his wife isn’t a person) who enjoys big family get together
I have three children two have raised their children similarly to how I raised them one very much so, the other with some differences a bit more controlling and protective but on the whole fairly similar the third one has probably done everything completely opposite I do not even recognise her parenting her way of bringing them up is alien to me with no structure, but they have grown up pretty ok kids and when they come to stay they adjust to my ways and seem to like it but immediately resort back to living in a bit of a pigsty with few regulations when they go home
Keep your chin up grandma your heart open and your mouth a bit closed to negatives (it’s hard many of us have to learn too)

Venall... yes it’s confusing and sad.

Thanks Bluebelle, yes everyone has different ways of raising children. The FaceTime thing worked well until a meeting over ran and I received a text message asking if I had forgotten his children .... not sure it will ever be resolved. We have large family lunches and it always feels so sad that he is there too ... I always strived to treat them all the same so feel he misses out which feels so sad.
Anyway this was mostly about differences. I can report I have received a message from him last night
‘Cheers for *******s present ??‘ well I guess it’s something