STOP CLAPPING!

Does anyone remember the lovely Children’s song “If you’re happy and you know it, Clap your Hands / Stamp your feet / Shout We Are”? Children have been singing and clapping this for generations to show how happy they are. It’s a sad reflection on society if we have to keep happiness and praise totally silent! Maybe a few people are affected by noise, but presumably they still have to cope with Mobile and ordinary phones ringing loudly (and unexpectedly), traffic noise, road works, loud aeroplanes overhead, noisy building sites, Police and emergency sirens etc etc. All are normal day to day noises, so a few moments of clapping can surely be coped with by anyone who is genuinely affected by whatever strategy they find suitable? We surely can’t all be expected to change a happy clapping habit of a lifetime, even centuries, just because some Uni person thinks it’s a “good idea”? After the stress of all the GCSEs and A levels Hype I would think most Uni students can cope with anything!

I dislike the use of the word 'twat' and I dislike 'snowflake' in this context as well, for 2 reasons:
1. We won't get proper exchange of ideas and discussions about improving public life if we use derogatory terms.
2. I find the snowflake analogy bewildering. I liked the Home-Start 'snowflake' campaign - because each child is unique and beautiful - but is has been subsumed by its use as a derogatory term.

Finding a way to be inclusive is very difficult. There is a middle ground between helping people to cope with the knocks & awkwardness of everyday life, and being sensitive and helpful.I come from robust stock and have brought my own children up to overcome difficulties rather than be knocked back by them. However, none of us have these crippling conditions.

I'd add that very few 'deaf' people have no hearing. Often their hearing is quite distorted, which is why certain noises can be overwhelming. My hearing impaired mother, when President of a local society asked people to 'clap quietly'. I don't think it occurred to any of us to find an alternative whilst she was alive.

Tillybelle- i fully understand how bad this type of disability is HOW PAINFUL it can be- so does my son.Whose missed a lot of time in school because of it as for years no one had diagnosed him when he tried to explain it- and even when they did he was sent to a school on the hospital ward as outpatient because his own school didnt know how to cope with it(they certainly didnt make everyone tiptoe around being silent or use jazz hands in assembly)not for him nor for the children with ASD issues,which he also has traits of,and like i said he himself(now 15) thinks its a stupid idea.

Perhaps a better idea would be to have a no-clapping section in the room, where all those affected by the sound can sit?

Nannan2 I think you, and others, are extrapolating to all theatres and performances quite erroneously! Dare I say it? - you are just trying to deride the students without sticking to the facts?

I am sorry to hear od your DS's hyperacusis, but as I said before, you cannot judge by one person. The research shows that MANY people are disabled by the overwhelming discomfort of sudden loud noise to the extent that they alter their lives and avoid places where they fear such noise might occur. Your son is not their Spokesperson. The research proves that.

As for deciding that BSL clapping will be used in all theatres at all entertainment - that is your imagination. The Manchester Students did not say anything like that!

The *truth& is this: This decision was taken for a specific place, and for specific public meetings. Nobody said use it at "The Royal Variety Performance".

Sara Khan (the union's liberation and access officer,) said BSL clapping will be used at student events such as debates, panels and talks.

That is a long way from Theatrical Entertainment shows!

I quote from the BBC:
"Ms Khan, who proposed the motion at a recent meeting said clapping can "discourage" some from attending democratic events.
"I think a lot of the time, even in Parliamentary debates, I've seen that clapping, whooping, talking over each other, loud noises, encourages an atmosphere that is not as respectful as it could be," she said."

What a sensible and polite young lady!
I would say that the noise, shouting, butting-in etc. in the House of Commons is a complete disgrace to parliamentary democracy and not the way adults should behave! Our Politicians could learn something from such a decent and well-mannered young student!

All she is doing, is to considerately and democratically enable as many people to attend these meetings as are entitled to be there and to ensure that no disability will keep them away. Furthermore, everybody will be given the right to be heard! Unlike in the House of Commons!

Good for Miss Khan!

My grandson has autism and puts his hood up if things are 'too much'- its not always just sounds causing anxiety which the university dont seem to be grasping.My daughter was diagnosed with aspergers and ASD issues later after turning 30- shes returned to uni now kids are at school&often has to go to lectures etc and she hasnt complained about the clapping& whooping either.Someone somewhere in uni has had this mentioned and assumed as usual that 'everyone' with these types of disabilities are the same.again.

This is the Manchester Student Unions response to the publicity. It was their policy not the university's

manchesterstudentsunion.com/articles/official-statement-on-bsl-clapping

It was to promote inclusivity for deaf people who use British Sign Language.

I agree with Tillybelle. It's good to see young people trying to help others with sensory difficulties.

It is complete nonsense - and anyone who cannot cope with clapping shouldn’t be in a public hall.

No tillybelle,but for the government its just one step away from doing this in universities/parliament to doing it everywhere else where people usually clap for ending of a performance! And,DARE I SAY IT?you seem to like jumping on a bandwagon and lecturing people for having an opinion just the same as you do.I sympathise with sufferers but they dont all avoid life.some find ways of coping."We cant change majority for a minority" is what some other posters have said and im inclined to agree..Disagree if you so wish.

And in parliament they probably always will continue to debate that way- its been so since parliament began..

Jazz Hands is how an audience show their appreciation of a performance/ speach by someone using BSL.
If you read Emily's link you will see this is typical media misrepresentation.
Smurf not everyone can cope with every day outside noise. My DS dosen't go anywhere without his head phones and his i-player

I presume then that MORE than one person has complained to the students union?,as you cant judge by one person..I never said my son was everyones spokesperson.i said HIS opinion.as a person suffering this.hes also entitled to an opinion.same as whomever approached student union to change things.you appear very opinionated yourself tillybelle.(are you the student union rep im wondering?)

Its a huge can of worms been opened up lindyloo!

Sorry.Lyndiloo.

Nannarose Thank you for all your wonderfully helpful comments! I did not know what "snowflake" meant but gathered it was disparaging. If people knew what the people in my research were going through they would be immensely cruel to disparage them. There are so many people who are unable to live full lives because of hearing problems and it was wonderful to read your information that deaf people do hear but hear horrible noises! Some of my patients were tormented so much by dreadful sounds of distorted noises from noise in the environment. They were very brave to leave their house at all!

I am glad you spoke out against foul language. It has no place here and reduces the discussion. Thank you for your words.

People are tending to speak from the experience of knowing one or two people with different hearing problems or ASD, but this is seldom helpful because a small but vociferous number does not reflect what actually happens across society. The research shows that there is a problem for people with hearing difficulties of many kinds and with different aetiologies. It causes immense misery to people who are unable to adapt to loud noise. I think the Students are very brave and have taken a huge step forward in trying to include people with this disability and to bring it to our attention. They are not stopping clapping in shows and plays etc in theatres! Why do people stray from the facts like this? They just want their students, all of them, to be able to take part in Student Union debates, discussions, meetings etc. That is very decent of them.

Every time I think I've heard it all up pops another clown with an even more stupid demand.

Tilly is one of the only few people on this thread that have not swallowed the 'fake news' being propagated by the mainstream media, and has actually looked at exactly what was being proposed by the considerate students.
Frankly, most of the other posters on this thread are showing exactly why 'oldies' are seen as so judgemental, intolerant and unable to look at what is actually proposed rather than what is fed to them by the MSM. Look at yourselves ladies (and gentlemen) you should feel ashamed at your negative attitude - but I don't suppose that you will, as none of you could possibly be wrong...

Well, that deserves some jazz hands!

Haha ooh, don’t hold back SueDoku
This isn’t ‘fake news’btw but something the students union are pursuing for their university.
I don’t think anyone has said it would be common custom to do this in theatres up and down the land.
I don’t think Ms Khan is a polite and considerate young lady either, but a far left and mouthy person, after hearing her on the radio.

I would sooner sit in silence than have to do 'jazz hands'.

^
This.

I have a mental image of actors/performers who, having finished their performance, will now be faced with a sea of people; sat in silence; frantically waiving their hands in front of them!
Wonder what the alternative will be when they ban cheering, uproarious laughter or booing? Will we have to do thumbs up/thumbs down?

I heard this on BBC TV this morning and thought I had misheard. As a public speaker I couldn't think of anything more weird/disconcerting than to have an audience that periodically started waving at me! Clapping is something that we all do spontaneously. A child will clap their hands with glee when they are happy. Chimpanzee do it as a form of communication too.

I work with young adults and children with ASD and am very aware of sensory difficulties whether it be hearing or touch and more often, both at the same time but I have never come across clapping as being an issue. We all have to be aware of everyone around us and help one another wherever possible but we also have a duty of care to help our youngsters learn to play their part in our world too and join in with the clapping or take a bow, whichever is appropriate.

......and stop treating everybody as a ‘victim’.

Sadly, after a great start, the human race has lost the plot. We've ruined the planet for future generations in the name of progress and now we're attempting to ruin every aspect of the societies we've spent centuries creating. It's time for another species to take over!

As I understand it, it is not 'banned'

Hmmmm

Hasn't the NUS said that they will be disciplining people who dont comply with the jazz handing at some if their meetings?

Look a bit deeper at what is going on in students unions. Compliant populist robots all singing from the sane hymn sheet, rather than a melting pot of ideas and discussions, seems to be the aim