Irish Abortion Laws

How do you know many TOP's take place because they are inconvenient, Annie? Have you carried out a poll to determine that?

You also contradict yourself. You say women have abortions because their pregnancy is inconvenient, then you state that many children available for adoption have had difficult and troubled lives. Perhaps that's a result of the mothers carrying on with an unwanted pregnancy.

Birth mothers have no legal recourse if the adoptive parents unilaterally decide to close the adoption and terminate all contact.

The demand for adoption of infants has also fallen off a cliff due to the availabilty amd now NHS funding of IVF and other assisted conception techniques.

That is not an argument against NHS funding btw, just a statement of reality.

It is now easier and quicker even with (successful) IVF to have a birth child than be approved for infant adoption.

Adopters as a result have become (again, in no way a criticism) choosier about what children they will accept. Children at risk from foetal alcohol syndrome, children of mixed or non white heritage, children exposed to drug use during pregnancy, these are all infants who already struggle to find any adoptive placement.

People are rightly encouraged to be honest and say if they would find it difficult to accept an adoption child rather than their “own” child and are screened out as a result. Again, not a criticism. I know a number of couples with fertility difficulties who absolutely ruled out adoption on this basis.

This is not the 1960s. There are not desperate willing adopters for thousands of unwanted babies with poor prenatal circumstances.

SueDonim, sorry no idea what a TOP is. Perhaps children are abused because they are the result of unwanted pregnancies ? Perhaps not

Sorry, I didn't think - it's termination of pregnancy, Annie.

Thank you Sue.

perhaps, troubled children in need of adoption are the result of unwanted pregnancies ?

How long has abortion been legal in England, Wales and
Scotland ? Since 1967.

I don't understand what you're saying, Annie.

Pro lifers talk about giving birth as if it is like having a toenail removed. It is not! It's all very well if you none of your daughters lives was hanging in the balance when giving birth, if like us, you had very nearly lost a daughter during childbirth we would never, ever, require a woman to give birth against her will.

You don't sound as if you are pro life at all, you sound as if you are just pro life in the case of unborn children.

Some of you sound as if you want to punish women for having sex.

I have never understood why the rights of an unborn foetus trump the rights of a living human being, personally...

Sue, you said perhaps the cause of troubled children in need of adoption was perhaps unwanted pregnancies It can’t be when abortion is so readily available .

Ilovecheese, sorry your argument is weak, rubbish to say pro lifers want to punish women for having sex. And the fear of losing your daughter must have been horrific for you, there is no connection between complications in pregnancy and unwanted pregnancies

Another huge problem is ordering medication online to assist abortions. With no medical advice this pills have caused women to die. The point of the yes campaign was your body your life..the individual gets a choice. Ireland has a bad reputation for looking after its women. Catch up about the recent cervicial cancer scandal.

There were no complications in pregnancy, there were complications during birth. You cannot say there is no connection between having to go through with an unwanted pregnancy and giving birth. Of course there is a connection. No woman should have to face that risk unwillingly.

Ilovecheese, there is no connection between an unwanted pregnancy and complications at birth.

After reading all the posts I have to say that mawbroons opinions on the subject leave me gasping in shock and horror

Suedonim I do not believe it is a bizarre comparison at all at the end of the day it is taking of a life..

However Pseudonym you did say something that made me realise that maybe the best thing happened with the yes vote and that's when you said that if it were not legal it would go on anyways but illegally and dangerously so that did make me think that these women were going to do it anyway but at risk to their life and no one wants that so I thank you for enlightening me which is why I started this post in the first place

I say thank you for those of you that were not afraid to say that you do not agree with abortion

ilovecheese you donot want women to be punished for having sex but your ok with an unborn child loosing its life due to two wally's having un protected sex.

it is all about being RESPONSABLE it is not ok to have sex without being willing to take the consequences which are bloody huge for an un born child.

I am done now because there are too many closed minds that are not willing to hear the CRYS of un born babies

Serkeen,that sort of emotional claptrap will just annoy folk...UNBORN babies dont cry...certainly not at the stage when most abortions take place .Some women get pregnant despite using contraceptives ...me ...twice .I went through with them because I was happily married BUT lost both babies ,one at 11 weeks and one at 34 weeks .Nobody LIKES or WANTS abortion ..but we do know that it is necessary for a lot of women.
closed minds.......kettle and pot there Serkeen

As Paddyann says, Serkeen, unborn babies can't cry. That's just emotional blackmail you're using in order to try and make women feel guilty.

I don't know why you started this thread, if you didn't want people's honest opinions. I also cannot believe you were unaware that pre-1967 women died in the UK at the hands of illegal abortionists. That's what would happen again if it were made illegal once more. Abortions would still take place, they'd just be unmonitored and unregulated.

Anniebach it isn't that easy to get an abortion. You need to find somewhere that offers the service to start with, you need two doctors to sign off and you have to take tablets on two separate occasions and you may well start bleeding and cramping in public while on your way home.

That really doesn't sound like a bundle of laughs to me.

I notice you didn’t comment on my post Serkeen. And I did specifically ask for your thoughts.

Gasp away serkeen I could counter by saying that your emotional claptrap left me similarly aghast that anybody could be so unaware of reality.
Your argument contains no logic whatsoever and to suggest that people in the U.K. care more about animals than children is the sort of unfounded generalisation one might expect in the Sun on a bad day.
Why on earth start a thread with a totally closed mind and unfounded prejudices?

Yes SueDonim do want other peoples opinion and it was your opinion and what you said that made me realise that the Yes vote might have been for the best because as you so rightly pointed out if it were not legal women would do it anyway and risk their life and no one wants that so thank you for opening my eyes to that.

Its a horrid old subject but I have learnt something by bringing it up.

I think I am being ignored ?

Thank you, Serkeen. In an ideal world there would be no need for abortion but sadly we don't live in an ideal world. We are all human beings with faults and foibles and that's what such laws try to take into account.

A bit of a volte face Serkeen and baffling in the light of your posts of 18.07 and 18.12
Yes, I think some posts are being ignored eglantine but congratulations to suedonim who seems to have succeeded where others clearly failed.

Will Serkeen think about the situation I described if I keep posting do you think? Even if she said the cries of two little boys count as nothing compared to the cry of an unborn baby.