What would you have done?

The Father will not own up even if it was the sons cap, as in his mind he will lose face.
He is a bully and by the description of what went on he behaved like a thug.
To be fair the school are probably aware id him.

You should definitely speak to someone at school about it. That sort of behaviour is unacceptable and is not tolerated. I would imagine that the father knows full well what he has done, as does his son, but probably won't have the good grace to do the right thing.

I think you certainly did the right thing by trying to intervene on behalf of the poor lad. I haven't read the whole thread but if it hasn't been suggested could you mention it to a teacher?
I'm not sure that much can be done but it sounds like this Dad could do with a taste of his own medicine.

I think the school should be informed. I believe they can then use this incident (without using the actual identifying circumstances) to teach children about bringing things that are very precious into school. A moral life lesson for all.

Who knows someone else staff or pupil may have seen the lad take the hat, and presumed it was his.

I think as an ex Head that schools must have due regard to teaching children about life in general, in this case both for children who have may have possessions stolen and for those that may be tempted to steal

Don't be put off by people who say "don't do it for fear of....". You did the right thing & he intimidated you too so you have a right to act for yourself as well as the boy. Tell staff, tell the boy's parents then you can rest. People told me not to report drug dealers outside our house & a police officer for racist language for fear of retaliation but there are some things we have to do because it is right & the duty of any citizen so the bullies don't get more of the upper hand they than already have.

If grans are doing childcare, pickups etc, then they do have a voice (to a certain extent at least!) - we should not be the silent servants of our children. We have lots of valuable experience and input of our own - so we should be able to speak out if it feels right to do so.

An interesting discussion. Well done gillybob for your intervention, so many people just let things like this go unchallenged. For me it's the use of foul language around children. Today's society is turning a deaf ear and saying nothing. I was in Toysrus the other day and a man (in his 30s) was on his telephone having s discussion (not an angry one) but was using foul language including the F word. There were children close by as well as staff members who ignored him. I tapped him on the shoulder and said "please be aware of your language". He ended his call and apologised to me. On another note how sad that grans cannot give their opinion without others being nasty, such a shame. Maybe another reflection on today's attitudes and what some deem as acceptable behaviour.

..and I would also track down the parents of the boy and tell them how brave he was and what he had done - they need to know too.

This aggressive man, who is probably encouraging his child in theft, does really need to be reported. If the school have a note of it then it helps build the picture if anything else happens involving his vile behaviour. If he does get some advice this may be something that his son sees or hears which will give him a different opinion about the situation too. As to the poor boy whose cap is likely was - he deserves some support from the school too as he was very brave, and so were you; it's not easy tackling mouthy bullies and you are to be congratulated. Well done!

A Crime appears to have been committed. You dial 101 and request police attendance to deal otherwise there is a possibility of a Breach of the Peace. You could have surreptitiously taken their car number. Hindsight is a wonderful science and your safety was paramount!
Explain to GS that there are some bad people in the world.

As a teacher myself, I would say report it to the head. The school can take out injunctions against parents who really do overstep in terms of aggression and this may be one more piece of evidence.

I feel very strongly that you should go and see the school, with the polite boy's parents if possible.
There are various issues here:
the possible stealing or at least taking of the hat (even if it was by mistake)
the rudeness, aggressiveness and bad language towards the brave little boy who asked about it.
and finally the aggression towards you.
These need to be addressed, and as this incident happened on school premises it is down to the school to look into.
If they refuse, I would take it further - to the governors or even the police.
I know this might seem extreme to some, but these behaviours cannot be allowed to escalate.... The little boy was very brave and so were you Gilly.

Well done for trying to stand up for the boy. I can't stand bullies and that man bullied you. At my ripe old age when I should keep quiet I won't whatever the consequence and would not be silenced until justice prevailed

For the sake of ur grandchild and the polite wee boy I d let it drop in case he gets bullied if taken further. Be aware of other family and keep your distance from horrible dad. . Tell ur family what happened.

It sounds like a horrible situation gillybob, upsetting for everyone except the brute of a father. For what it is worth I would report it to the school. Chewbacca, I thoroughly agree with your last point, ironic or not?

gillybob you were brave to have said anything, I think I would have gone to the school office, did the mother of the little boy who thought the cap was his arrive?
It's hard to know what to do in that situtation, isn't it.

Agree with Chewbacca. Somebody in my opinion does the right thing, and asks others thoughts and the post gets very nasty.

I feel heartsick for the little lad who tried to do the right thing about the cap. He was polite and did everything as he should have done. I too feel sorry for the son of the obnoxious father because he's being set a very poor example of life skills. Talking about life skills, why are some posters, usually the same ones, unable to go onto any thread without being vitriolic and nasty and personal? Why does the most innocent of subjects always have to give them an opportunity to make others feel uncomfortable just reading their posts? What do they think being sly and nasty to others achieves? I can't help but draw parallels between them and the obnoxious father at the school gate.

Just to make it very clear this did not happen outside the school svalentine60 it happened in the playground. I asked the dad nicely to show the boy the label as I thought it would end the situation. I am not playing judge or jury. I so wanted there to be no initials in that cap. Believe you me. But the fact that he refused to show it, took it from his son, stuffed it in his own pocket and spoke aggressively the way he did, makes me suspect otherwise.

You did the right thing, that is for sure. What an awful role model that dad was, if it was his dad?? He in that minute has shown his son how to behave, lie, cheat, be rude, aggressive, hide the evidence etc. That is assuming it was the other lads cap which I believe that it probably was. What an unfortunate way for that father to show his son all the wrong ways to react in that situation. He could have simply said, "sure lets have a look". Then after he follows it up with an obvious lie about the nanna in Spain. Pity that child if the man was in fact his "father." Beggars belief!

This is rather clear cut isn't it? The issue is justice and power - you happen to be an adult who witnessed the exchange and if you do not act then the little boy will have experienced injustice and the abuse of power! Not good. Report it to the head and follow up to see what action was taken - if you know the parents of the lad then inform them of what you witnessed too. The school will be familiar with this family and their 'issues'.

I disagree with you "svalentine60", the child was clearly upset with no adults with him. All the original poster did was suggest that they look at the initials on the hat and the matter would have been cleared up.

As others have said I would let the school know about this incident. It would seem that the boy who asked politely to look inside the cap was the rightful owner of it.. and the father of the boy wearing it knew it did"nt belong to his son. There are several things here that the school could address in the form of a general letter to parents: not to bring items of sentimental value to school......stealing ......also general conduct at the school gates. I would like to think that the boy whose hat it is gets it back eventually..but by the sounds of the other boy"s father I have my doubts.

I think using sweeping statements against the other boy when you have no factual evidence the cap was his or that he has ever stolen anything previously is ridiculous. The father might simply have been annoyed (As i would have been) that you butted into a conversation that was nothing to do with you. If in fact the cap had been stolen it was disgusting. No question of that. But you are playing judge and jury. Also you say this happened outside the school so anything said outside the school is none of their business i'm afraid. They can only act on things that happen inside the school. it is up to the parents to deal with the cap question and nobody else. I am sure they will do that.

Dealing with gits is not easy and sometimes best left alone some people just love the scrap.

I would try and tell the lad's parents that he had asked so politely about his hat, without luck and leave it at that.

Hopefully his dad is bigger than the other dad. No point you getting into a long term situation with someone who sounds as if they love trouble.

I doubt if the school will do much if they know what he is like.

I was so lucy when my kids were young and we lived in a rough area, some of my friends were well known gangsters and we never had any trouble at all.........move on 15 years when we had moved and I had 2 more children, OMG the changes in dynamics at the school gates. The parents are worse than the kids, mummy mafias are in control........

You did your bit let the boy's parents do the rest.