Difficulties with grandchildren's nanny (employed person, not other grandparent).

Agree with Merlotgran. I think you should just let your daughter know when you are going to see them or take them out and do it. what right has the nanny to lay down access rules? Just go for it and good luck.

Young friend is a nanny & withdrew quickly from the busy nanny social round, because she was horrified by how some 1.Behaved towards the children 2. Arranged the household and timetable to suit their own needs and social round - then boasted & joked about it with their friends.
It's easy to do because the parents are so totally dependant on them.

Was the nanny employed through an agency? I think I'd be tempted to check out her employment history.

Nannies are trained in how to get along with senior family members and incorporate their visits into the daily routine because it's important that children have a normal relationship with family members other than their parents.

It sounds as though her own social life is top of her agenda and not the children,s.

Too true!!

I think you need to speak with your daughter and son in law. Are they aware of how Nanny is changing arrangements ad hoc? If they have arranged a set time for visit with you, then it is not Nanny's place to change those arrangements to suit her, and her activities with the children.

I wonder if your daughter and son in law can tell Nanny that for the hour (or whatever length of time your contact is for), she is off duty and that you are to be left alone with the children.

I am caught between two schools of thought here

one - that Nanny sees herself in the equivalent role of old school matrons in hospitals, who had a definitely role to play and no one ever questioned her, and your being there just interferes with her routine

and

two - what's she got to hide. I would be looking for a good nanny cam!

She may be reliable but she's a control freak and alarmingly rude to you and, it seems, to the other granny! If you get on we'll can you two arrange a 'Granny day'?

My daughter has two nannies who do two days a week each. They've done this since the baby, now 18mths, was very small as daughter had a broken foot and was unable to lift the baby. I have collected grandson, now 10, from school one day a week and grandpa does two days since he was at nursery at 2 years old.

One nanny is very experienced and efficient and cooks meals for the freezer when the baby has her afternoon nap and is training her in good ways. The other was not experienced at all but a loving girl and Spanish speaking, which dad is, so the baby is growing up bilingual.

Both nannies are lovely to spend time with and encouraged me from the first to feed and bath the baby, which they'd normally do and grandpa doesn't . We both try and spend time with big brother too, although he he is wonderful with his baby sister and they enjoy playing together.

i actually find the nannies much easier to get on with then my daughter, who is a very picky person. She and the children are vegan so she does have to enforce strict rules about food, but also the children's timetable. I've substituted for a nanny on occasion when they've been off sick etc and sometimes daughter worked from home, monitoring my work.....

I do try and get on with her as I want to see the children, and she can be delightful too when all goes well. She's a very good mother and we are lucky that the nannies are such nice people too.
I suppose your daughter won't want to try another nanny. it does seem a shame to spoil your enjoyment of your grandchildren like this.

I never ever got the feeling the nanny would tell me what to do or be rude, although the experienced one has suggested, gently, that grandpa and I should try saying 'no' when the baby, who is a very definite person, like her mother (and I do love it when she does it to mum) wants things and we all try and please her.

She's just walking but not talking yet, but makes demanding noises and we can usually guess what is wanted. I think because she understands Spanish and English the speaking is a bit later.

Just an idea ..... Would it be best for you and the other grandma to try and speak to the parents together, maybe suggesting a regular 'day' for grandmas.

It doesn't seem over the top to me for you to see the grandchildren once a week. But you could try for a regular once a fortnight date ... Perhaps alternating between your homes. With the nanny coming too

What a difficult problem. You all need to be on the same page so an honest open discussion is a 'must'.

Good Luck

Flaming cheek! I would tell her I will see MY GC whenever I want to thank you very much! If it doesn't fit in with her socialising then tough!

As someone else has said- arrange a weekly visit when you can either take them out (best option!)or have them to yourself. She must have other duties- ironing etc.she can do while you have them.

Tell your daughter you are doing this as the nanny is so rude to you & stick to it.If you are prepared to give time to your GC your daughter should be very grateful& you will be there when Nanny has gone too. I'm sure they will need babysitting or minding on school holidays so they should be cultivating your relationship with your GC.
Don't let nanny make the rules for you too!

mutti it makes me think that the nanny perhaps is socialising too much with the other nannies, hence her cutting short your visits with your DGC. Something doesn't fit.
I think it is quite reasonable for a GM to see her DGC once a week if living near.
Get your DH to negotiate? Suggest nanny could have time to sort DGC laundry when you visit? Good luck.

Elegran, it didn't all happen in the space of half an hour. It only occurred to me to ask gransnetters for advice yesterday because a fairly long-standing situation unfortunately erupted when I let my feelings show, ill-advisedly I know. It was a case of a minor thing being the final straw. But indeed I wish I had just put on a social face and let it go. That would have been the gracious - and far wiser - thing to do.
I first started visiting weekly, under a previous nanny's dispensation, in order to help by minding the baby while the then nanny took the older child swimming, then later I ended up taking older child swimming. That nanny developed knee problems and really welcomed a second bod around. We are actually a close family (though I realise it may not sound like it!); DH & I babysit enthusiastically when asked and help out in crises: for example, when one nanny left suddenly, I stayed there to look after the children until another nanny was found; last year the children stayed with DH & me for a week because this current nanny wanted a particular week off when my daughter & son-in-law had to do something else. I say this, not to polish my halo (!), but to try to give a rounded picture.
I get on very well with the other grandma but she is a gentle soul - older than me and a widow, so without a husband to sound off to! - who avoids conflict and, though deeply loving of the DGs and very good with them, accepts that she just won't see them as much as she would wish. We are both concerned that the current nanny wields undue influence. The other grandmother finds it difficult to talk to her son and I find the same - though not so bad - with this one daughter (with my other daughter communication is easy).
As you all say, discussion is now the only way forward as the difficulty can't be swept under the carpet any longer. And DH & I know we will have to accept whatever our daughter & son-in-law decide. This nanny is defensive & controlling but she runs the household efficiently (I don't think she has anything to hide, btw) so maybe I have to take more of a 'what will be will be attitude'. DH and I intend to listen to our daughter & son--in-law and we hope they will listen a bit to us too. We should have had a discussion about it before and actually I think I tried once but it became heated and confused so I backed off. My daughter & son-in-law always seem tired & stressed which doesn't make talking easy. Also, we see them alone extremely rarely - the children or other adults are generally present.
Sorry for the long posts. I have really appreciated your replies and, if anyone is still reading (!), I would be very interested to read how any of you have approached discussions on tricky subjects with your adult children, especially how you prevent feelings from running high. Thanks again.

Thank you, mutti The time scale wasn't apparent.

Could you (without letting your blood-pressure shoot up!) point your daughter at this thread? It may be helpful for her to read a written account of what is happening, set down calmly, instead of hearing it verbally and interrupting with her own frustrations so that she doesn't hear all of your side. Perhaps you could even write it all down yourself and give it to her to read when she is not harassed.

It seems to me that the nanny is very efficient and organised, and doesn't see any reason to compromise an inch of her efficiency to suit anyone else. That is all very well, but relationships within the family are as important to the children as their daily routine, and surely if she is professionally trained she knows all about that?

I suspect she has a view of herself as one of those nannies in Victorian sagas, who take charge of every aspect of their charges' lives and rule the rest of the household too as though they are all still in the nursery under her iron will. Her employers may be happy to leave it all to her while they get on with their careers, but at what cost to family unity?

Any help to (not 'report' or 'gossip' or 'whinge') to approach the subject with your other daughter?
I'm a bit concerned that the tired and stressed parents have come to rely heavily, (too heavily?)on the nanny and her efficiency. In which case anything negative you say about her may come over as interference and undermining of the family lifestyle.
It's a sad dilemma with the DGC getting older and more removed from you all the time.
Do you send them the occasional postcard or not? This could help maintain the link between you and GC, they usually love to get unexpected post.
Good luck with this unpleasant situation.

mutti I can relate regarding how to approach grown up children on tricky subjects. I have 3 grown up sons who also have very busy lives. Most phone calls from them are preceded by 'I've only got a minute mum but...'. It's gone on for so long now that I find it quite amusing. During the calls I usually say something like 'you'd better go son, you're busy' which is almost always met with 'no, no, it's fine'. I think this is a symptom of the times we now live in.

I've had to approach my sons on occasions about difficult subjects and know how agonising this can be. Elegran's suggestion of pointing your daughter to this thread is an excellent idea. Another option is to send your daughter a gentle email on the subject. I've done this (very rarely) with my sons and have been very surprised at how well they responded. One son went on to say that he was glad that I had. Oddly, he said that because he was as at work, he had the time to read and digest what I'd said! Both of these methods also remove the opportunity to interrupt and also to get over any initial irritation your daughter may feel.

You'll know best whether these are good options for you. One way or the other, I hope you are able to find a way to resolve what is a difficult situation for you and that you're able to spend time with your GC again. Best of luck.

Seems to be a turnover of nannies!

You know your family, but can you suggest a reason for the turnover. That might be a key to this ones attitude. Do nannies chat to each other and compare notes?

Alarm bells should be ringing loud and clear, this woman is not mary poppins best thing you can do is turn up unexpectedly and keep doing it as often as you can.As i have said in another post there are some outstanding childcare practioner's and some really bad ones out their.

Jolly, there's an explanation for the turnover of nannies: first one came when six year old was six months and DD resumed her demanding career - this lady stayed over three years and we all got on well; unfortunately she had to retire because of worsening knee problems and sadly there followed two disastrous ones (first one who was extremely unreliable and kept going off sick and then one who had to be sacked by my daughter because she turned out to have hidden mental problems which her referee had not mentioned in the reference). Interestingly, both of these nannies came through reputable agencies! During the time of these two highly unsatisfactory nannies DD became understandably extremely stressed. There were two lovely temporary nannies as well who, along with DH, me & the other grandma, held the fort during this difficult time. The current nanny has been in post for two years and I suspect that the trauma of the preceding six months is part of the reason my daughter is so worried about upsetting her. The plan is for this nanny to remain for another year, or just over, until the end of the youngest child's first term in school. The nanny does no housework, though she does cook for the children, so she will have little to do during the day once the youngest is at school, but DD is sensibly keen to avoid a changeover of primary carer at the same time as the little one starts school. She will be young for her year anyway, and won't have had the experience of full-time nursery school beforehand, as the nanny has argued my daughter into only sending her three mornings a week even though she has to pay for five.
It just seems such a shame that this younger DGC may well not see anything like as much of her grandparents (with whom she is so affectionate) during this formative childhood stage as she or we (and, I suspect also my daughter & son-in-law .. provided it doesn't impinge on other aspects of their lives) would wish.
Incidentally, I would not dare turn up unannounced. If I arrive even ten minutes before the appointed time it causes ructions.

I have no experience of nannies personally but have watched `The hand that rocks the cradle ` lol . I would not trust any stranger with my beautiful children/grandchildren regardless of me having a career /job/ busy life . Why bother having them . I am sorry but the op really annoyed me, firstly that the parents are giving full control of there household and children to someone they don`t know and secondly that this person in their employ is behaving in such an odd way and no one is questioning it . If I were in your position I would turn up at anytime of day I chose just to see what is going on and why she is trying to block visits to YOUR grandchildren .

She's been with them two years, seen off one grandmother and you daren't turn up unannounced or it will cause ructions? She also decides how many days a week your grandchild can attend nurery school?

Who the hell does she think she is and more fool your DD and DSiL for allowing it to get this far.

I'd have either murdered her by now or told DD that I won't be calling round anymore but they know where I am if they need me. No way would I be made a fool of by a hired help, for that is all she is at the end of the day.

To ameliorate this discussion to a more normal one. [ i.e. family orientated].

Why do mum and dad have to work so hard? Is it for the kids or their own egos

I presume perhaps wrongly, that status is involved, house, nanny, posh whatever.

Do your best as a granny , along with the other one.

Children are a gift for a small time , but then its their lives, an abbrevrated Ghibran saying

This is a difficult one. Sounds the nanny is a tad insecure of her own capabilities and is on the defensive.
Any chance of dancing to her tune, for now, as you don't want to upset the children or your daughter.

I don't think for the moment that she will try and come between you and your grandchildren and she has to have a break at some time so can you then have a quiet word with your daughter tell her how you feel and then it really is up to your daughter.Sorry, but they are her children.

Ructions with who? The nanny ? You need to "woman" up and be a grandmother. Unless the ructions are with your daughter, just ignore the nanny's ructions. Just tell her to put her feet up, have a cup of coffee and a break - after all she's being well paid for it, and if you want to see your grandchildren it is your perfect right to do so. You give the impression you're scared stiff of the nanny and the Nanny must be revelling in wielding all this power over you !!

This is a very interesting thread, in terms of the different views expressed. From the information you have given, which seems to be fair and even handed, there are those who think the Nanny is doing a bad job, the family needs a nannycam, has ideas above her station and is rude, that she wants to socialise too much. The other view is that she is a professional woman who is doing the job in the way your daughter wants her to.

I am sure that not many of us employed a Nanny. Either we stayed at home, or shared care with other mums or relatives. I feel that this woman, although not perfect is an essential part of your daughter's household. If it came to a choice between Nanny and Grandmother I think the Grandmother will lose.

I would be very reluctant to stress your daughter even more with complaints about the Nanny. I am sure you are not going to make demands as some have suggested. Those that say you have 'rights' to see your GC are sadly out of touch. As for woman-up and be confrontational, I am sure you will not go down that path.

Quietly supporting your daughter is the way to see more of your Grandchildren.

This child is three years old, the other one is six.

This, presumably, is not the same DD who has just had another baby (other thread)?

If Nanny is trying to keep the children to a routine it could be difficult to have someone else coming in and disrupting that routine (after all, it is her job, she can't just go and have a cup of coffee and put her feet up!). Perhaps the children become badly behaved after a visit by DGM who may spoil them. Who knows?

On the other hand, if proper arrangements have been made between parents and grandparents then it is not up to the Nanny to change those arrangements.

It's very difficult - a nanny is carrying out the instructions of the parents, not the grandparents and you need to speak to your DD and SIL about the arrangements and any concerns you may have.

You don't say if the nanny lives in or works as needed. If your daughter and her husband want to socialise at weekends, could you have the grandchildren then?

You mention "previous nannies" - plural - how many have there been? I only had one nanny in five years as I wanted continuity for my kids. Is you daughter difficult to work for? If that's the case maybe this one is what she wants whatever you think of her.

Does she know what's going on? Ask her if she wants her children to see less of all their grandparents - if she does, sadly there's not much you can do about it. If she's happy for you all to see the grandchildren, be honest about the nanny and her comments and rudeness and suggest she asks her 6 year old what she thinks of this nanny. Kids are usually very honest.