Friend betrayal

she should have been aware of the issues.

What issues??
There is nothing at all wrong with helping a colleague compose a letter re disciplinary action. Anyone can do this. And she was under no obligation to disclose this to the OP. She can help a colleague with this there are no "issues" its a perfectly fine, normal, helpful thing to do, and does not = "picking sides" or any childish nonsense the OP is reading into it. It does not matter that she knows the manager in another capacity, in small towns especially most ppl do, doesnt mean they cant assist a colleague!

The OP on the other hand wanted her "friend" to act differently to other employees based on their outside of work friendship.

You're not the friend are you notanan? You seem to be inexplicably angry and over invested in this scenario. Is it you?

I disagree Dillonsgranma. When you walk into work, you leave all friend and family loyalties at the door (to collect on your way out). Emm14 needs to look at the situation from a purely professional point of view.

You're not the friend are you notanan? You seem to be inexplicably angry and over invested in this scenario. Is it you? hmm

If it was I would be busy printing it off for HR!!

I'm mainly shocked that GN posters would encourage this manager in wanting to prevent one employee from helping another, on the basis that she saw one and not the other as her personal friend!

notonan, the point I was making was if the person is a counsellor , she should be acutely aware of boundaries. If the other employee had asked for help she should have made an appointment and/or directed her to HR.

Friendship, counselling, the workplace and a manager giving a friend a job ,all seem like bad news to me.

Lessimore HRs actually point out to people going through consultations/disciplinaries that they can bring a colleague into meetings etc.

It is not odd or problematic for a colleague to help!

It is if you are a counsellor. I was not talking nonsense counsellors have to be absolutely impartial. I am not taking sides as such just believe this counsellor has very poor boundaries. She shouldn’t be offering to talk to either colleagueb

I'm sorry but that IS nonsense! Of course councellors can talk to colleagues and help them out!

Dear me these are caring professions, they are allowed to care about each other not just the patients.

What boundary was crossed? Helping a colleague write a letter does not cross a line!

She did not do a councelling session she helped with composing a letter. They can even have opinions outside the boundaries of councelling sessions! There is nothing at all wrong with her giving a colleague support in this way. And helping someone get fair process does not prevent you being "impartial" , not that she actually needs to be in this instance, she would be perfectly entitled to discuss management with colleagues and agree with them if she thought the team (which she is part of) was being poorly managed.

She is not the staff councellor, she is part of the team and acting as part of the team rather than as the bosses lap dog!

This is a colleague she has helped out! Not a patient/client!

In the 27 posts you've posted so far notanan, I think its fair to say that we now fully understand your views on this.

I do not agree with you notanan2 but cannot be bothered to argue the point any more. You obviously think you are right so carry on

You're not the friend are you notanan? You seem to be inexplicably angry and over invested in this scenario. Is it you? hmm

You took the words right out of my mouth Chewbaca ???

I know people can bring a colleague to an interview....and rightly so.

I was making the point that the friend is not some ill informed , confused worker. As a counsellor she should be clear, super clear. Of course counsellors are humans, have friends and can give advice/write letters. Why not? I just think maybe she could have done so in the workplace, that way it would be clear and transparent.

I agree with notanan2 that assisting a colleague write a letter does not cross boundaries and that to do so does not mean she was necessarily on the colleague's side. However, notanan2 doesn't appear to have addressed the point that she attempted to discuss the matter with the OP which is where she has blurred things.

However, notanan2 doesn't appear to have addressed the point that she attempted to discuss the matter with the OP which is where she has blurred things.

I actually did.

I said that if there is an ongoing open disciplinary it affects the whole team and there was nothing wrong with the friend asking the OP how she was doing IMO

It is the OP and other posters that superimposed malicous intent there, but there isnt necessarily any. Sounds like the issue was already general knowledge and checking the OP was okay as well as helping the colleague arent necessarily conflicting actings.

It's like if friends divorce, you can help one with packing and still ask the other how they are holding up!

Why couldn't the person ask a friend away from work or an impartial person for help?

OK that's it now, off to listen to some music.

Why couldn't the person ask a friend away from work or an impartial person for help?

They are healthcare workers. If the disciplinary issue included any service user issues that would not be appropriate.

And if not, a colleague would understand the workplace/event better anyway. It is really NOT unusual, or generally frowned upon, for colleagues to support each othet through disciplinary issues!

If anything, you would worry if caring professionals DIDNT help and support each other!

Besides why should they? Surely the colleague and the friend could not have predicted that the OP would react in this "you're MY friend not THEIRS" way.

They were quite standard innocuous actions and am baffled that GNers agree that the friend should have declined to assist a colleague on the grounds of being friends with the manager! Am really quite shocked by that!

Emm14

I read your original post first thing this morning and wanted to respond, but did not, because I was sure someone with better professional advice would come along.

No one has,

So:
PLEASE ASK GRANSNET TO DELETE THIS POST.

You have given far to much information on what is a PUBLICLY AVAILABLE forum, which would easily identify the people involved.

You mention that you work in health care. What you have posted would immediately get you suspended if you worked for the NHS -a private company will have their own regulations - however if your "friend" or "member of staff" or their representatives see this post, I have no doubt you would be considered to be in breach of contract and guilty of gross misconduct, particularly if it involves disciplinary proceedings.

I am no expert, but I know employment law allows a person undergoing disciplinary procedures to have a person of their choice to accompany them to any meetings with management.

You have no right to feel either "betrayed", "flabergasted" or "let down" by your "disloyal" friend - because she is not a friend in this context, she is an employee, as is the member of staff undergoing discipline, as are you.

What you do moving forward in your relationship with your friend personally has no bearing on the work issues.

Trust, loyalty and friendship outside your workplace is for you both to decide after the dust has settled.

These are my thoughts.

But I would again strongly advise:

ASK GRANSNET TO DELETE THIS THREAD.

Wishing you well.
Meg

This friend recently told me in all innocence that she had heard I had disagreement with this staff member and did I want to talk about ( I didn’t)?

I think this might be what particularly hurts the OP, that her ‘friend’ would try to get further information about the disciplinary matter in an underhand way.

People never cease to amaze me, how they betray you and turn their back on you. Sadly, it's very often the very people that you have been there for and supported, sometimes through difficult times. It's very hurtful and just makes you feel used and abused. The old saying "What goes round, comes round" springs to my mind more and more often, I'm afraid.

Talk to her - whoever told you that she'd supported the misbehaving member of staff may not have told the whole story. It could save you and her much grief and the loss of the friendship , if you can tell her calmly what you've been told, ask her if this account is correct , and take it from there. If she says 'yes' it is what happened, you can calmly tell her how you feel about it and what you want from her now. E.g. you may say you expect her to keep personal and work issues apart and never to talk to other staff about you - come to you directly if she has any concerns. At the moment you haven't given her a chance to 'clear her name' and it feels bad for you and probably for her too - she will not be immune to your changed attitude. She may have done what you've been told! and I understand your distress, but take a step towards giving her a fair hearing and I think you will feel a lot better, whatver the outcome.

I think that is terrible advice. Management cannot tell employees that they cant talk to each other about management.
You also cant tell employees that they cant be friendly with each other and do each other favours!

There is no reason for the friend to be "given the chance to clear their name"

The OPs feelings/problems about what happened are personal not professional